4.15.14
Albert Rosales
(2 Hours, 11 Minutes)

BoA:Audio's extended Spring Break comes to an end as we welcome tireless researcher Albert Rosales for a discussion on his extensive chronicling of humanoid encounter reports. Over the course of this exhaustive conversation, we'll discuss the many various forms of humanoids that can be found in Albert's work, including greys, giants, Nordics, Bigfoot, and aquatic creatures. Additionally, we'll hear dark tales of nefarious encounters with humanoids where dire outcomes afflicted the witnesses who spotted the entities. We'll also talk about trends in humanoid reports and speculate on the 'big picture' meaning behind this strange phenomenon.

Altogether it is a comprehensive conversation which covers a vast array of aspects surrounding the truly mystifying humanoid encounter phenomenon with a researcher who has compiled a stunning 17,000+ cases of this puzzling enigma: Albert Rosales.

Full Preview: We kick things off with our standard bio / background on Albert Rosales, how he got interested in UFOs, and what made him decide to focus on humanoid reports. Beginning our conversation about the 'humanoids,' we start by having Albert generally define what a 'humanoid' is, within the realm of his project. We also have Albert speculate on the various types of humanoids that are detailed in the 17,000 cases found on his website as well as the "paranormal elements" found in some cases. We also discuss whether cases like Black Eyed Kids or contactees are included amongst the realm of 'humanoid' encounters.

We also delve into how classic humanoid encounters appear in religious writings in the form of angels or other spiritual apparitions. This leads to some talk about instances where communication occurs between a humanoid and the witness and we have Albert detail what sort of messages are imparted during these encounters. Albert reveals a surprising trend amongst Eastern European humanoid contact cases and what sets these apart from typical American encounters. Based on the sheer variety of humanoids that are reported, we have Albert speculate on what the origins of these creatures may be. Albert also reflects on the rise in strange incidents in the 1970's.

Circling back to the basics of Albert's project, we find out how he gets the cases profiled on his site, which leads to some talk about how the fall of the Iron Curtain led to a huge increase of information about humanoid encounters in the USSR. Looking at humanoid encounters, as a whole, we ponder how the vast majority seem to be inadvertent run-ins with these entities, rather than purposeful contact. This leads to some talk about the reluctance of witnesses to share their stories as well as societal factors, such as religion, which would keep people from sharing their story.

Next we have Albert detail the story of a bizarre 2007 case from Poland where a humanoid may have been captured on video. Returning to instances where communication occurs between witnesses and entities, we find out about cases where the humanoids claim to 'know' the person they meet. Albert also shares one intriguing story of a man who encountered a human-looking entity at a UFO. In light of Albert's work chronicling humanoid reports, we discuss how, in early Ufology, only APRO investigated such reports while NICAP discarded the stories.

Considering the vast amount of humanoid encounter cases documented by Albert, we ponder why there is, paradoxically, a dearth of tangible evidence for any of these stories. Additionally, we find out if there are many instances of people shooting at humanoids. In light of Albert's prodigious online work, we find out how many cases he gets nowadays. We also find out what sort of effect these encounters appear to have on the witnesses who report meeting a humanoid. Albert then shares a story of a family in Australia that was tormented by strange 'visitors' to their home.

Looking at cases from the last 100 years, we find out if Albert has noticed any overarching trends amongst all those cases. After all these years and all these cases collected, we find out if Albert ever finds himself jaded or exhausted after receiving yet another humanoid encounter report. From there, we learn about the truly bizarre 'Type X' cases which are so strange that they don't seem to fit into any 'classic' ET encounter case, such as stories of people getting on a UFO and seeing a Bigfoot interacting with the on-board aliens. Additionally, we find out if Albert has ever gotten any push back from the 'powers that be' over his humanoid research.

Based on his years looking at the humanoid encounter phenomenon, we find out if Albert has ever come to any conclusions about what it is all about. Next we reflect on the 'permanent abductions' cases which have emerged from Albert's collection of humanoid encounters. We then have Alfred speculate on why it seems like Latin America is a hotbed for strange humanoid encounter stories. We also reflect on why it seems like humanoid encounters are still widely under reported in the paranormal media today. Physical effects befalling people who encounter humanoids is our next topic of discussion and Alfred shares some truly gruesome cases.

Beyond the UFO connection, we also discuss potential folkloric tales which could suggest some kind of humanoid encounter. This segues into us talking about the flummoxing nature of the UFO phenomenon and whether or not we'll ever find out the answer to the UFO mystery. Albert then shares a particularly intriguing case from Israel in 1993 where a woman confronted a giant humanoid. Looking at the other side of the coin, we find out if Albert has any cases where people have been positively affected by an encounter with a UFO or humanoid.

Heading towards the close, we revisit some of the differences between UFO and humanoid reports in the US versus Russia and ponder why there seems to be some serious differences in what witnesses have reported. This leads to some talk about the potential that nuclear advancement ushered in the UFO phenomenon, which turns into talk about the Middle East and the jinn. Following that, we cover robot encounters that have turned up in Albert's work as well as encounters with aquatic entities. Albert also shares another type of encounter where people are told that they are being prepared for some mysterious future event.

Closing out the conversation, we speculate on the possibility that these encounters could be projections of the witnesses' mind. Wrapping up the conversation, we find out what's next for Albert Rosales and if he's ever considered compiling his material into a book or several books. He also talks about nefarious folks who have copied his work and then tried to sell it on Amazon.

BIOGRAPHY

Albert Rosales was born in Santa Clara, Cuba in 1958 and migrated to Spain with his family in 1966 and then to the United States in 1967. He lived briefly in the Bronx and then moved to Miami where he has been since 67. After high school and college, Albert joined the Navy where he served for four years, had two med cruises, and earned a top secret clearance. For the last 30 years, he has been working in law enforcement. His work on humanoid encounter cases has been ongoing for the last ten years and has resulted in a compilation of over 17,000 case files. Albert's work can be found at ufoinfo.com/humanoid

Albert Rosales.mp3

SEASON 8

11.5.13
Frank Feschino
(2 Hours, 3 Minutes)

In a LIVE edition of BoA:Audio, UFO researcher Frank Feschino makes his long-overdue first appearance on the program to discuss his meticulous and remarkable research into both the Flatwoods 'Monster' Case as well as his groundbreaking book Shoot Them Down, which details the 1952 UFO wave that spawned an official military order to 'take down' the mysterious craft invading American airspace.

This is an episode which stretched the very limits of our live format and is absolutely jam packed with a wealth of fascinating insights into an amazing time in UFO history.

Highlights: We get the standard bio/background on Frank Feschino and learn about how he got interested in UFOs. This leads to a side road discussion about his early work investigating crop circles in West Virginia as well as the considerable amount of UFO activity reported in the area.

From there, we dive in to the Flatwoods Monster case and Frank tells us about his early troubles earning the trust of locals who had been ridiculed for decades about the case. Next, Frank provides a breathtakingly detailed account of the Flatwoods Monster incident, painting a picture for the listener of how it all unfolded that evening.

Over the course of that discussion, we learn why the infamous original drawing of the Flatwoods Monster is highly inaccurate and how this led to great misconceptions about what was seen by the witnesses that night. Frank also details how the Flatwoods incident connects to the 1952 spate of US Air Force planes engaging UFOs that were flying all over American skies that Summer.

In the final half hour or so, we're joined by Alfred Lehmberg, who has investigated the Flatwoods case on-site with Frank for Monsterquest and done considerable research into the UFO phenomenon. Alfred reflects on the foolishness of skeptics trying to debunk the Flatwoods case as well as Frank's tremendous work using Project Blue Book to decipher UFO activity of that era.

Altogteher, it was a blisteringly fast episode and a rare instance where the two hour live window actually left us with not enough time to talk, since we only scratched the surface of Frank Feschino's stunning and exhaustive research. Until we can get him back on the program again, you can check out additional material from him via this YouTube presentation.

Frank Feschino.mp3

SEASON 8

10.15.13
Peter Robbins
(2 Hours, 3 Minutes)

Acclaimed UFO researcher, author, and lecturer as well as longtime friend BoA:Audio, Peter Robbins, returns to the program for a LIVE edition of Season 8. In this fast paced two hour conversation, we cover everything from how Peter first got interested in UFOs back in the late 1970's all the way up to his role in this year's Citizen's Hearing on Disclosure.

Highlights: We begin by getting an update on what Peter has been up to since his last appearance on BoA:Audio and he tells us about his presentation at the Experiencers Speak Conference as well as a recent trip to Rome for a Wilheilm Reich conference. The Reich discussion continues as we learn about his research and how it appeared to alter the weather and seemed to attract UFOs.

We then revisit Peter's origin story as far as UFO research goes and he recounts the incredible story of how, in his late 20's, he suddenly remembered a vivid childhood UFO encounter that he and his sister experienced as teenagers. From there, we get Peter's excellent advice for newcomers to the field of UFO research and what they should strive to do as well as avoid as their work evolves.

Next we talk about Peter's participation in the Citizen's Hearing on Disclosure this past April, we revisit his paper regarding the dangers of UFO disclosure and religious fundamentalism, and we muse about how the ridicule factor continue to stymie UFO media coverage. Peter also talks about the new UFO Truth magazine and his recent article which takes Steven Greer to task for making ludicrous proclamations about aliens.

The episode also includes Peter's thoughts on the science v. activism schism in UFO studies and a caller who asks about the falling out that happened between Whitley Strieber and Budd Hopkins. And, closing out the program, Peter preview the New England UFO Festival taking place on October 26th in Leominster, Massachusetts.

BIOGRAPHY

Peter Robbins has been involved in UFO studies for more than twenty-five years, as a researcher, investigator, writer, lecturer, activist and author. He is a board member of Budd Hopkins' Intruders Foundation and is co-author of the British best-seller Left at East Gate: A First-Hand Account of the Bentwaters-Woodbridge UFO Incident, Its Cover-Up and Investigation.

Robbins has lectured extensively both in the States and abroad, including dozens of talks throughout the United Kingdom. Venues have included local, national and international conferences as well as presentations for organizations, seminars, private groups, public, private and secondary schools, universities, libraries, scientific organizations, educational foundations and Cambridge Hospital in Boston under the sponsorship of the late Pulitzer Prize winner Dr. John Mack.

Robbins’ lecture topics have included but not been limited to the United Kingdom’s RAF Bentwaters-Woodbridge UFO incident; the suppression of UFO information by the American and British Governments; James Vincent Forrestal, first Secretary of Defense and early casualty of UFO secrecy; the emergence of the national security state; Dr. Wilhelm Reich and UFOs; the UFO abduction phenomenon; the crop circle phenomenon, and the media and UFOs.

Peter also served as Art Director and investigator for the New York City-based Scientific Bureau of Investigation (SBI), a national police and civilian UFO research organization and as Editorial Assistant on [requested] "Blue Memorandum" for Parliament's House of Lords Debate on UFOs, January 1980; Research Assistant on United Nations Secretary General's Report "for the establishment of a UN-UFO Department."

He can be reached at facebook.com/probbinsny

Peter Robbins.mp3

SEASON 7

8.6.13
Season Finale
Travis Walton
(1 Hour, 45 Minutes)

BoA:Audio closes the book on Season 7 as we welcome legendary alien abductee Travis Walton for an in-depth discussion on his historic UFO encounter and the subsequent firestorm which continues to swirl around the case to this very day. Over the course of this compact but comprehensive conversation, we'll explore Travis' life and story from a myriad of angles, spanning 1975 to 2013, and explore the evolution of abductions, in general, as well as how UFOs and the media have changed over the years. Along the way, we'll venture down a myriad of side roads and explore some surprisingly unexpected realms.

At long last, we conclude our marathon seventh season with an iconic and ironic player in the epic history of paranormal studies: Travis Walton.

Full Preview: In lieu of the traditional bio / background, we kick things off by finding out if Travis ever gets tired of rehashing his story and recounting events which happened nearly 40 years ago. Travis talks about how his perspective has evolved over the years and, in modern times, his motivation has taken on an entirely new hue. We also reflect on how perspectives on abduction have changed over the years and that, instead of being afraid to share their stories, people (and abduction support groups) now seem to be more open to revealing their possible alien encounters.

Next we get Travis' take on hypnosis as a tool of abduction research, especially in light of recent stories showing it to be suspect, and learn what percentage of his story is gleaned from hypnosis versus conscious recall. He also talks about how skeptics surrounding his story and hypnosis fail to address the myriad of other witnesses to the event. Revisiting one key aspect of Travis' story, we dig into the detail of how he saw a humanoid entity aboard the ship, talk about how this detail seems to get glossed over by media coverage of the event, and have him provide additional information on his interaction with this being.

Looking at the human element at work in UFO studies, we find out what it was like for Travis to 'meet' the UFO research community in 1975 when he first returned from his encounter. In light of all of the trouble that befell Travis after the event, we find out if he ever considered just shunning everyone from the UFO research community. Additionally, we talk about how Travis was treated like "a bug in a jar," rather than a human being, by researchers as well as how the general public scrutinized his every action to a bizarre and laughable degree. He also reflects on one of the biggest problems facing Ufology and how that has not changed since 1975.

With the benefit of hindsight, we ask Travis if there was anything else he should have done, upon returning from the craft, that he wishes he had. Travis also talks about when he realized that he was in the middle of an international news story and how he reacted to that realization. He reflects on how his experience with the media has given him a unique perspective on how the industry works. This segues into us talking about how different Travis' experience would have been if it had taken place in 2013 rather than 1975, which leads to us talking about how the UFOs may have modified their behavior due to modern technology being so pervasive.

We then revisit the perennially hot topic of UFO disclosure, getting Travis' perspective on the concept. Considering the perceived pressure from the government on UFO witnesses, we find out of Travis was ever pressured by the 'powers that be' to silence him. This leads to some talk about Travis' nemesis, Phil Klass, and we discuss some of his weird actions and whether or not they are clues that he may have been working for the government. Following that, we explore the relationship between Travis and his work crew as well as how things changed following the event and media firestorm. He also reveals a potentially tantalizingly new development on that front.

Travis shares stories of how random people have claimed to be a part of the work crew or even critical parts of the Travis' story when they weren't actually involved at all. Travis reflects on the positive and negative aspects of this bizarre 'civic pride' affiliated with the case. With that in mind, we find out if there has ever been anything done to commemorate Travis' event or if it is in the works for the 40th anniversary. Travis also reflects on his disappointment with the National Geographic special on his case as well as which special he thought did the best job on it. In hindsight, we find out of Travis would still have participated in the movie Fire in the Sky or done things differently.

After that, we revisit Travis' recent appearance on the Fox TV program Moment of Truth, where he allegedly failed a lie detector test regarding his experience. Travis details the chicanery involved in the program as well as the technical issues surrounding the administration of the lie detector test. This leads to Travis talking about his experiences taking polygraph tests as well as what it was like taking the text for the TV show.

Heading towards the close of the conversation, we also have Travis extrapolate on his change in perspective and how he sees himself more as a victim of circumstance rather than a deliberate abductee. Looking at the stories of the Hills and Travis, we get his take on how the narrative of abductions have changed over the years. Wrapping up the conversation, we find out whether Travis thinks abductions should be separated from UFO sightings, whether we'll ever find out what the whole UFO mystery is all about, and, finally, what's next for Travis Walton as 2013 unfolds.

BIOGRAPHY

On November 5, 1975, a group of loggers in the mountains of northeastern Arizona observed a strange, unusually bright light in the sky. One of those men, Travis Walton, recklessly left the safety of his truck to take a closer look. What happened next sent his companions fleeing in fear. When Travis failed to reappear, the men were suspected of murder. For five days authorities mounted a massive manhunt in search of Walton or his body. Walton eventually reappeared, disoriented and initially unable to tell the details of his terrifying encounter. His book Fire in the Sky provides an account of his experience. A major motion picture was also made with the same name.

His website is travis-walton.com

Travis Walton.mp3

SEASON 6

12.7.11
Mack Maloney
(2 Hours, 6 Minutes)

BoA:Audio welcomes prolific military fiction author Mack Maloney for a discussion on his new non-fiction work UFOs in Wartime. During this free-flowing conversation, we'll cover a number of cases and trends surrounding UFO sightings by soldiers during times of hot and cold conflicts. The Foo Fighters, Scandinavian 'Ghost Rockets' and 'Scareships,' the Battle of L.A., the 1950 D.C. Flyovers, Vietnam UFO reports, and Gulf War UFO rumors are just some of the areas covered in this wide-ranging conversation. We'll also examine some of the bigger picture issues surrounding UFOs, such as their potential origins and motivations.

It's a candid conversation with a richly talented writer, Mack Maloney, who has recently turned his gaze towards the UFO phenomenon and uncovered a startling, unnerving, and persistent mystery lurking in its midst.

Full Preview: We kick things by getting the bio / background on Mack Maloney and find out how his prolific career as a writer led him to looking at the UFO phenomenon. We find out what sources and ufologists Mack talked to as he did his research into the book. We also hear about his brother's amazing UFO sighting and the troubling way that the government handled his report. This leads to some discussion on how getting soldiers to reveal their UFO encounters if fraught with difficulties.

Mack then talks about one of the central questions that drives the book and his research, which is whether the military really knows what is going on with UFOs. We also turn this question around on Mack and have him speculate on what the answer is. Leading to some more 'big picture' issues surrounding the UFO phenomenon, we get Mack's surprising support for one of the more fringe theories behind the UFO phenomenon.

Next we dive in to the ideas found in UFOs in Wartime and ponder why the enigma seems to have such an interest in humans in conflict as well as why those behind the UFOs don't intervene in these battles. He provides his perspective on the paradox of why UFOs are so blatant yet mysterious. Looking at one historical tale mentioned in the book, we have Mack detail the theory that UFOs were somehow related to the outbreak of the plague in Europe.

We talk about the 'scareship' wave in 1909 Scandinavia and Mack details this lesser known UFO flap and talks about some of the more enigmatic aspects of the wave, including a tale of odd metal debris being found and the mysterious men who appeared to be trying to confiscate it. Based on Mack's research, we get his opinion on the 'changing face' of UFOs and if there has been an evolution in the shapes and descriptions of wartime UFOs. This segues into some reflection on how UFOs always seem to be only a generation or two ahead of human technological abilities. Mack fleshes out this idea by comparing the Scandinavian 'scareships' with cruise missiles that were developed in later generations.

Given that Sweden and Scandinavia had two distinct major UFO waves in the early 1900's, we ruminate on why that part of the world would draw such UFO interest in that time. This leads to some discussion on how no one (or nation) ever came forward to claim responsibility for the Scandinavian waves nor the foo fighters of WWII. Staying within the realm of the foo fighters, Mack details why it was impossible for the phenomena to be German 'wonder weapons.'

Pulling the camera further back, we talk about how the UFO line of 'ours v. theirs' has been tremendously blurred in the modern age. Next, we find out why Mack contends, in the book, that Roswell probably was not the case of a crashed flying saucer. The conversation then heads into the world of UFO-nuke encounters and Mack details some instances where the phenomena appeared to have significant interest in America's nuclear capabilities.

Looking at the classic 'UFO on the White House lawn' scenario, we talk about how paradoxical that concept is, considering the 'Battle of LA' had half a million witnesses, and Mack talks about why that event did not have the 'disclosure' impact it theoretically should have had. Going along, chronologically, we examine how UFOs flew over Washington D.C. in 1950 and were rebuffed by fighter jets, which calls into question the whole 'White House lawn' scenario.

Our conversation then turns towards if and when the UFO enigma will be solved and Mack speculates on the answer to that question. Going back to the 'foo fighters,' we talk about the 415 Squadron, which coined the name 'foo fighter' and had a significant number of sightings, had a pair of mysterious human visitors who did a study on the phenomenon and then promptly disappeared. Looking at a UFO event from another war, Mack shares the story of a US hit squad which had a dramatic UFO encounter and then an even more bizarre interrogation by their superiors.

Taking our chronology up to more modern times, Mack shares some of the rumors he has heard regarding UFOs and the first Gulf War, including tales that Saddam Hussein got his hands on a craft or possibly even its ET pilots. This brings us around to the hypothetical idea that knowledge of ETs/UFOs would constitute 'weapons of mass intelligence,' yet they are never used by sinister governments hoping to cause world upheaval. We then go back to the idea of UFOs harming humans and how it seems, as far as reports are concerned, such incidents are more incidental and accidental than intentional.

Jumping around to some of the more bizarre tales and aspects found in UFOs in Wartime, we look at how, during the 1950 D.C. Flyover, one pilot could see the UFO while the other could not. We also discuss how UFOs seem to be able to react to individual people on the ground who can see it. Looking at Ufology as a whole, we reflect on how much of the era discussed in UFOs in Wartime was relatively quaint compared to the wilder world of UFO research in modern times.

Heading towards the close, we examine what it would take for the UFO puzzle to be unlocked by humans, starting with the public relations stumbling block involved in getting an endorsement for further UFO research by the scientific community. We talk about what areas seem to be poised to be the first to breakthrough on the UFO puzzle. Given the many fans of Mack's fiction books, we find out what they have thought about his foray in UFO writing. We also reflect on how there is a lag time in on-the-record UFO reports from soldiers who are either in the service or just out of service.

Closing out our conversation, we find out about how Mack's brother once worked at Area 51 and he shares some details on his brother's job there. We also find out what's next for Mack Maloney and if he'll continue his foray into the world of Ufology.

BIOGRAPHY

Mack Maloney grew up in the Dorchester section of Boston and was taught to read and write by the nuns at St. Ann's School. His father was a veteran of World War II and he used to read military books all the time. As a child, Mack started reading them too, along with a lot of science fiction. He received a BS in journalism and a graduate degree in filmmaking from Emerson College. He was a sports reporter for two years after college before joining corporate America as a publicist for General Electric Company. Mack started writing books in 1984, and have been doing it full time since 1987, penning over 30 books.

His website is mackmaloney.com

Mack Maloney.mp3

SEASON 6

11.1.11
Loren Coleman
(1 Hour, 51 Minutes)

Making his long-awaited return to BoA:Audio, the iconic Loren Coleman joins us for an in-depth and richly arrayed conversation about cryptozoology. We'll talk about Loren's amazing International Cryptozoology Museum and have a lengthy discussion on Bigfoot as well as the state of Bigfoot research. We'll also cover a veritable menagerie of cryptids including the Orang Pendek, Yeti, the Loch Ness Monster, Champ, Ogopogo, the Montauk Monster, Alien Big Cats, Chupacabras, Thunderbirds and even the Tazelwurm.

It's a conversation which spans the pantheon of cryptozoology's most famous and infamous creatures with the legendary Loren Coleman.

Full Preview: We kick things off by finding out about Loren's International Cryptozoology Museum, which moved to a larger location on 11 Avon Street in Portland, Maine on October 30th. Loren details the origins and evolution of the museum, which began in his home in 2003 and, ultimately, became an international sensation when it opened its doors to the public in 2009. Loren discusses the massive media coverage that the museum has received as well as the reaction from skeptics and pop culture anthropologists. This leads to some discussion on how the museum serves as a unique research opportunity as it affords Loren the chance to see a wide array of visitors with varying degrees of cryptozological interests and beliefs. We also reflect on how the museum serves as a clearinghouse of crypto materials so that researchers' collections can be preserved and not discarded or destroyed.

Diving into pure cryptozoology talk, we begin with Bigfoot and reflect on both the resurgence in interest in the creature and also have Loren share his thoughts on where we stand in the quest to prove its existence. Loren talks about the paradox of high interest in Bigfoot contrasted with low funding for real expeditions as well as potential "secret projects" being undertaken to help solidify the case for the creature. Loren then shares a bold prediction on how Bigfoot may ultimately being proven to be real and explains how he came to that conclusion. Along those lines, he details an expedition along those lines which proved fruitless due to mistakes made by the researcher.

The conversation then leads to discussion on a recent troubling trend in Bigfoot research: Bigfoot "contactees." Loren details the story of a woman from Michigan who claimed to be in contact with Bigfoot and voices his concerns and suspicions about people who claim to have consistent, ongoing contact with the creature. Returning out conversation towards proving the existence of Bigfoot, Loren talks about how the burden of proof for the creature is tremendous due to its very name and place in pop culture / paranormal lore. Looking at a post-Bigfoot world, we speculate on how, once one creature has been acquired, additional animals as well as evidence will likely quickly emerge. Along the way, we also talk about Sumatra's Orang Pendek and Loren shares his thoughts on the ongoing quest to prove the existence of that mysterious creature.

Going down a strange road, we get Loren's take on the urban legend that the US government secretly removed scores of Bigfoot bodies from the area around Mount Saint Helens when it erupted in the 1980's. He also responds to rumors that the government has secret footage of Bigfoot obtained from advanced satellite technology. On a similar subject, we next look at the overwhelming rise in "Bigfoot videos," which have emerged in the digital age as camera phones have exploded in popularity. Staying along those lines, we have Loren address the controversies surrounding the Patterson-Gimlin film, notably the suspicious behavior exhibited by the filmmakers after they'd allegedly filmed the creature. Beyond that, Loren also addresses a number of claims that the film was hoaxed.

Next we talk about Loren's recent book, co-authored with Mark A. Hall and titled True Giants, and he discusses some of the findings presented in the book and how it relates to the Gigantopithecus theories. He gives his take on the theory that there are a number of different bipedal primates around the world, not just one singular species of creature. Looking at another major theory surrounding Bigfoot, Loren weighs in on the "paranormal / interdimensional Bigfoot" hypothesis, explains where he stands in 2011 on it and talks about that theory's resurgence in interest in recent years.

Getting meta on cryptozoology, we examine its place as a science versus its role as a genre of the paranormal. Loren talks about dealing with skeptics, the foundation of cryptozoology as a science, and how it leads to new animal species actually being discovered almost every day. This leads to Loren talking about the Coelacanth, which serves as part of the ICM's logo.

Moving on to another of the "celebrity cryptids," the Loch Ness Monster, Loren provides a look at where the search for Nessie stands today. He looks back at a proverbial "changing of the guard" in Nessie research and explains how that has led to a change in perspective on the field. Loren revisits his trip to Loch Ness and reflects on his observations of the area. This leads to some discussion on "sea creatures," in general, such as Champ and Ogopogo. Along the way, Loren revisits the "Monster Latitudes" theory from Ivan Sanderson. Next, we get Loren's take on the Montauk Monster, a creature who's name he coined, and he details what kind of animal it appears to be. This leads to Loren reflecting on the overwhelming number of dead animal stories which the media attempts to connect to cryptozoology.

Heading towards the close, Loren talks about the rise of Alien Big Cats in North America including one that recently turned up in Connecticut. Getting back to the Chupacabras frenzy of recent years, Loren looks at that specific phenomenon and contrasts it to the actual, original Chupacabras. Having looked at the cryptids of land and sea, we then turn to the air and talk about the Thunderbirds. Given all the creatures discussed throughout the interview, we ask Loren what other cryptids are lurking beneath the surface that he finds particularly intriguing. This segues into some discussion on how cryptozoology is actually split into two segments: mystery creatures and out-of-place animals. Closing out the conversation, we find out what's next for Loren Coleman, including the big ICM move as well as books in the works and a percolating movie project.

BIOGRAPHY

Loren Coleman is one of the world’s leading cryptozoologists, some say “the” leading. Certainly, he is acknowledged as the current living American researcher and writer who has most popularized cryptozoology in the late 20th and early 21st centuries. Starting his fieldwork and investigations in 1960, after traveling and trekking extensively in pursuit of cryptozoological mysteries, Coleman began writing to share his experiences soon after his first expeditions.

Coleman’s first cryptozoology magazine article was published in 1969, when he was 21 years old. His first book was published in 1975. Today, Coleman has written more than 6000 columns and articles, as well as over 30 books. He has appeared frequently on radio and television programs, and has lectured throughout North America, as well as in London and at Loch Ness. Two of his newest books for 2010 are Monsters of New Jersey (with Bruce Hallenbeck) and True Giants (with Mark A. Hall).

Coleman established his International Cryptozoology Museum, in 2003, in his home, and he extended beyond merely receiving media and research guests by appointment, when the museum went public in 2009. After two years of massive media coverage, the museum re-located to an new, larger location on 11 Avon Street in Portland Maine, which befits its enormous popularity.

Loren is a frequent contributor to cryptomundo.com and the ICM's website is cryptozoologymuseum.com.

Loren Coleman.mp3

SEASON 6

9.29.11
Butch Witkowski
(2 Hours, 9 Minutes)

BoA:Audio welcomes longtime researcher of high strangeness, Butch Witkowski, for a discussion on human mutilations and the field of Ufology. Butch will tell us how he came upon the human mutilation mystery, key cases where people have died under mysterious circumstances that suggest they were victims of human mutilations, and how the field of Ufology as well as government authorities make it particularly difficult to investigate the phenomenon. Plus, we'll cover the paranormal nature of Pennsylvania, time portals, and the accusations leveled against Butch in the last six months that he fabricated his background.

It's an episode that may have you looking at the abduction phenomenon and cattle mutilations in a suspicious and frightening light as we explore human mutilations with Butch Witkowski.

Full Preview: We kick things off with the standard bio / background on Butch Witkowski, finding out how he got interested in the UFO phenomenon, his own sighting and the evolution of his research. Butch talks about his decade away from UFO studies, his departure from MUFON, and how his interest and study of human mutilations developed. Getting into the human mutilations, Butch talks about the staggering number of people in the United States who vanish each year. He also extrapolates on how he drew the connection to UFOs, abductions, and cattle mutilations.

Butch then takes us to the front line of human mutilation research and talks about how he was warned off on the subject. He then talks about one key HM case: Sgt. JP Lovette, who had a UFO encounter in 1956 that led to him vanishing and later his body being found mutilated. He also talks about some other mysterious UFO cases that suggests some human mutilations had happened. Butch goes into tremendous detail on a 1988 event in Brazil which he calls the most promising of all potential human mutilation cases. Butch shares some specific notes about the case which make it particularly troubling and suggest that the human mutilation victim was alive while being dissected.

Next, he talks about a truly weird case from Egypt in 2005 where three families were "butchered" under mysterious circumstances. This leads to some discussion on the difficulties in finding human mutilations cases, since authorities investigating mysterious deaths are likely to use any reason for death that isn't remotely paranormal. Getting back to human mutilation cases, we go in-depth the infamous Todd Sees case from 2002 that has gained notoriety in Ufology circles. Butch also reveals the surprising number of cases he's uncovered that appear to be human mutilations. He also teases additional cases that appear to be cropping up from England in the 1500's.

Getting somewhat meta, we have Butch weigh in on why it seems like Pennsylvania seems to have an inordinate number of paranormal events and investigators. Staying within the realm of weird PA stuff, Butch tells us about his investigation into time portals in Pennsylvania. Butch also reflects on what his longterm goal would be for his UFO research. We also have Butch speculate on what is really going on with the UFO phenomenon and we talk about the potential connection with human mutilations, vanishing people, black ops programs, and other tangential areas of paranormalia. We then find out if the cattle mutilation phenomenon is still as prevalent today as it was during the apparent heyday of the 1970's and 80's. We also find out what the reaction of the UFO community has been to Butch's research as well as his take on the evolution of UFO research in recent years.

Staying within the realm of "inside Ufology," we have Butch respond to the accusations leveled against him by factions within the UFO research community. He takes us over the course of these accusations, how they developed over time, and what he plans for a longterm response to the accusations. Butch also reflects on the support he's received from other UFO researchers as well as speculates on why these accusations have surfaced in recent months. Heading towards the close, Butch details what's next for him, including projects involving human mutilations and other UFO-related projects.

BIOGRAPHY

Butch Witkowski has been an independent researcher since 1989, when he and four others witnessed a UFO of unbelievable size hover over “A” Mountain in Tucson, AZ. Witkowski joined MUFON in 2007, giving him more access to cases and on-site investigations. He became a Field Investigator, State Section Director, and Chief Investigator for Pennsylvania MUFON. Witkowski was also made a member of the Star Team.

After relinquishing his position as Chief Investigator, he started the UFO Research Center of Pennsylvania. He brought together the best like-minded researchers and consultants he could find. Together they pursue both historical and new cases, and, with a little luck, will resolve some cases of High Strangeness.

Butch Witkowski.mp3

SEASON 6

8.31.11
Kathleen Marden
(2 Hours, 13 Minutes)

In anticipation of the upcoming Exeter UFO Festival, BoA:Audio welcomes Kathleen Marden, the niece of Betty and Barney Hill, for an in-depth discussion on the iconic abduction case which is celebrating its 50th anniversary this year. Kathleen, who has had an invaluable first hand perspective on the case, takes us through the entire experience in breathtaking detail, covering the initial incident, the subsequent years of investigation by NICAP and Ufologists, the historic and terrifying hypnosis sessions with Dr. Simon, the traumatic 'outing' at the hands of unscrupulous press, the overnight celebrity bestowed upon the couple, and Barney's tragic demise which led to even more bizarre incidents for Betty Hill. Plus, of course, tons and tons more.

It's a comprehensive discussion with Kathleen Marden, a researcher who was afforded an amazing first hand perspective on one of the Ufology's most historic events of all time.

Full Preview: We kick things off with some bio / background on Kathleen Marden, beyond merely her intimate connection to the Hill case. Kathleen recounts how she actually heard of the close encounter the day after it happened, traces her career as a social worker and educator, and brings us back around to the mid-1980's, when her interest in the Hill case was reinvigorated. Kathy also recalls how, from that point, she embarked on a comprehensive investigation into the case, with help from Betty Hill and her tremendous collection of files pertaining to the case. She also details her comparative analysis on Betty and Barney Hill's original hypnosis tapes as well as dream recollections from Betty, which skeptics claim laid the groundwork for the abduction story.

Bringing the listeners fully up to speed on the Hill case, we have Kathleen recount the original event, which she does with remarkable and breathtaking detail. Kathy takes us throughout the entire evening, from the initial UFO sighting to the terrifying close encounter with the craft to the abrupt blackout and period of missing time to the next morning's confusion over what exactly had happened the previous night. Kathy also details some of the intriguing physical evidence from the encounter which suggests something truly anomalous occurred.

Taking us back to her own role in this historic event, Kathy tells us about how she first heard about the encounter, via a phone call her mother received on the very day that Betty and Barney had returned home from the fateful trip. She also recalls her family visiting Betty and Barney two days after the abduction took place and the remarkably specific details, from his conscious memory, that Barney mentioned about the encounter. We find out what Kathleen's family thought of Betty and Barney's story as well as what concerned them about the encounter.

Looking at one bizarre aspect of the Betty and Barney Hill story, Kathy shares the story of how, a few months after the encounter, the couple returned home to find Betty's earrings, which she wore on the night of the abduction, sitting on the kitchen table under a pile of dead leaves. We also speculate on who the "suspects" could be for such a bizarre action and, depending on who did it, what the implications of that might be.

We then continue onward with the chronology of the Hill case as we find out why the couple decided to report their case to authorities and how it ended up being brought to the attention of the UFO researchers at NICAP. Kathleen also reveals the chronology of when the couple actually became interested in using hypnosis to learn more about what happened to them and the timing is likely to surprise most listeners. Kathleen also notes the historical impact, within UFO studies, of NICAP looking at a UFO encounter that involved the sighting of beings.

Next, we talk about the Hills turn to hypnosis as a means of unlocking the memories of their encounter as well as dealing with the post-traumatic stress involved in the entire affair. Kathleen provides some deep insight into the work of the Hill's therapist, Dr. Simon, who was an acclaimed nueropsychiatrist. We also find out what Dr. Simon's initial perspective was on the case. Kathleen also clarifies and explains how Barney underwent hypnoanalysis rather than hypnotherapy with Dr. Simon. Kathleen also provides a number of details surrounding the hypnosis sessions, which went on for about six months.

Moving along in the timeline of this remarkable story, we find out about how the Hills' story was told, without their consent or permission, by a newspaper article in 1965. She reflects on how devastating this turn of events was for Betty and Barney and reveals how the couple reacted. Kathleen takes us to the living room of her grandparents' home on that evening, where the family debated what to do about their story being revealed in the paper. She also theorizes on how the reporter got his information and tells us about Stan Friedman's attempts, in later years, to get the reporter to reveal his sources.

Following that, we get meta and examine the issue of abductees being treated as 'specimens' rather than human beings by the research community. Kathleen talks about how troubling it was for Barney to listen to his hypnosis tapes with researchers in the room and how there are some common misconceptions about how Barney reacted on the night of the incident. (Note: At this point in the interview, we experienced some very strange technical difficulties, where Kathleen's line would cut out while answering this specific question. We've left some of them in the final audio, in order to best capture Kathleen's complete answer as well as the strange nature of the difficulties.)

Getting things back to the chronology of the Betty and Barney Hill story, we learn about how, after being outed by the newspaper, they decided to get pro-active and tell their story to the public and media. Kathleen explains how these turn of events led the Hills to John Fuller writing The Interrupted Journey, which told their story and ended up becoming a New York Times bestseller. She also talks about how this frenzy over their story ended up leading to the Hills becoming quasi-celebrities, which had a detrimental effect on Barney's health, possibly leading to his death at the age of 46.

This leads to discussion on how Barney's death changed Betty's life, especially in light of the UFO incident, as she was no longer part of a tandem and was forced to defend and talk about their encounter by herself. Kathleen then reveals how some truly bizarre and troubling events began to unfold at Betty's house following Barney's death. Kathleen ventures a guess as to who was behind these strange events and speculates on the motives behind them. (Note: Eerily, this was the only other area of discussion where our phone conversation began cutting out once again).

Looking at the Betty and Barney Hill case from a big picture perspective, as the ushering in of the 'abduction era,' we have Kathleen provide her thoughts on how the abduction phenomenon has changed over the last few decades. Given that this year marks the 50th anniversary of the Betty and Barney Hill case, we have Kathleen ponder the legacy of this monumental UFO event. We also find out if any new information about the case has come to light in recent years, so long after the event took place. Looking again, at the historical aspects of the case, Kathleen tells us about the remaining physical evidence from the case as well as analysis that was done on Betty's dress from that night. Kathleen also provides a detailed look at Marjorie Fish's Star Map work.

Heading towards the close, Kathleen talks about the Betty and Barney Hill historical plaque that was recently erected in New Hampshire. She details how arduous the process was and how the small paragraph on the marker had to be extensively sourced. Kathleen previews the upcoming 50th Anniversary Celebration of the Betty and Barney Hill case, which will take place on September 23rd at the Indian Head Resort in Lincoln, NH. She also previews the Exeter UFO Festival, which will take place on September 3rd in Exeter, New Hampshire. And, closing out the conversation, we find out what's next for Kathleen Marden as 2011 comes to a close and 2012 looms on the horizon.

BIOGRAPHY

Scientific Ufologist Kathleen Marden earned her B.A. in Social Work at the University of New Hampshire in 1971. Thereafter, she entered into graduate studies in Education at the University of Cincinnati, and later, at U.N.H. She began her professional career as a social worker and eventually entered the field of education as a teacher. Later, she was promoted to a supervisory position, coordinating education programs and supervising education staff.

She left her job in 1990 to pursue a career as a UFO investigator, researcher and writer. She taught adult education classes on UFO and abduction history, and for 10 years volunteered as the Mutual UFO Network's Director of Field Investigator Training. In 2003, MUFON publicly recognized Kathy for her most outstanding contribution of advancing the scientific study of the UFO phenomenon by dedicating the annual MUFON International UFO Proceedings to her.

As the niece of Betty and Barney Hill, Kathy had the opportunity to observe and learn from many of the great late abduction researchers in action. As such, she has been able to present substantial evidence that the Betty and Barney Hill UFO abduction was possibly a veridical experience. Her 2007 book Captured! The Betty and Barney Hill UFO Experience, with coauthor Stanton T. Friedman is a case study of her aunt and uncle's 1961 UFO close encounter and abduction.

In 2010, Kathy co-authored Science Was Wrong with Stan Friedman. 2011 brought a new book, UFOs and Aliens, with a chapter on alien abduction by Kathy. Her new DVD, "In Their Own Words" was released in June 2011. Kathy has appeared on dozens of television and radio programs in the US, Canada and Europe, including the History and Discovery channels, NH Chronicle, FOX News and Coast to Coast AM. Additionally, she has lectured at major conferences and colleges throughout the United States.

Her website is kathleen-marden.com.

Kathleen Marden.mp3

SEASON 6

3.28.11
Stan Gordon
(1 Hour, 31 Minutes)

BoA:Audio welcomes veteran UFO and paranormal researcher Stan Gordon for an in-depth discussion on his book Silent Invasion, which details the UFO/Bigfoot wave that swept across Pennsylvania in 1973/74. We'll get some amazing first hand perspective on the wave, as it unfolded, from Stan, who spoke with countless witnesses hours if not minutes after their encounter with the unknown. We'll hear about the bizarre nature of the Bigfoot reports, the media frenzy that surrounded the wave, Stan's work with local authorities and how that got him access to truly fresh and odd cases, mysterious signs of clandestine government interest in the wave as it unfolded, and Stan will recount some of most mind-blowing cases that he investigated, including a few which saw both UFOs and Bigfoot at the same time.

It's an invaluable glimpse of a moment in time where it appears that the paranormal veil was shredded in Pennsylvania from the man who was on the ground during the madness and diligently documented it all as it went down: Stan Gordon.

Full Preview: We kick things off by finding out about the remarkable beginnings of Stan's career as a paranormal investigator, which began in the 1960's when he was around twenty years old, and how he launched a UFO research organization and hotline. He traces this trajectory up to the 1973/74 UFO / Bigfoot wave which is the subject of Silent Invasion and Stan reflects on being in his mid-20's at the time and really being the primary, lead investigator of this massive wave of bizarre events. This Stan talking about some of the remarkable evidence and testimony that he documented from the wave.

Diving in to the specifics of the '73/74 wave, we first talk about the stunning volume of cases investigated by Stan and his group during the timeframe. We the detail how the strange wave of UFO reports of 1973 turned into Bigfoot reports that Summer and, in the fall, both phenomena were being reported, mostly separate, but sometimes together. Looking at some of the more unique cases that were investigated, we talk about a pair of UFO sightings which were reportedly accompanied by an odd smell.

Turning our attention toward the creature reports from the book, we begin by finding out about the three-toed footprints, which seemed to be the predominant track associated with the sightings. Stan also talks about some of the Bigfoot reports that he received prior to the big wave and how the strange events of 1973 changed his original perspective on creature. We also discuss the mood of the media during the wave and how the frenzy led to Stan's research organization became inundated with UFO/Bigfoot reports.

Stan tells us about his working with the state and local police agencies during the wave allowed for some remarkable access to 'breaking' reports of strange phenomena. Revisiting Stan's first hand perspective on the wave unfolding, we find out what he and his group, primarily associated with UFOs, were thinking as they began getting a slew of Bigfoot reports in the Summer of 1973. Stan reflects on the remarkable July 31st, 1973 Bigfoot report that seems to begin the massive wave that followed in the subsequent weeks and months.

We then examine one of the more intriguing underlying themes of the book: small details and clues from a variety of cases which suggest that some shadowy group within the federal government was also investigating these creature sightings in the area. On the Bigfoot front, Stan details some specific cases which were particularly intriguing, including one where the footprints seem to disappear out of thin air and another which was so strange that his colleague who investigated it decided to stop researching the paranormal. Stan also shares the tale of the night his group had a stakeout and may have been very close to one of the creatures.

Following the UFO/Bigfoot wave to its proverbial crescendo, we hear the amazing story of Steve Palmer from October 25th, 1973, where witnesses saw a large red sphere float into a field and transform into a glowing dome and, while it remained stationary there, two Bigfoot were seen lurking near it. Stan also shares the strange detail about mysterious, unknown investigators who interviewed and hypnotized the primary witness of the event. Examining another bizarre and unique case from the wave, Stan tells the story of a woman who actually shot a creature, which led to a very strange 'reaction' from the entity, and later saw both Bigfoot and UFO phenomena taking place at the same time.

Getting meta on the paranormal community, we have Stan recall the reactions from the ufological and cryptozoological communities when he published some of his cases following the UFO/Bigfoot wave. We also find out what the reaction has been from those communities to the publication of Silent Invasion a few months ago. Taking things to a speculative level, we have Stan give his perspective on what the connection between UFOs and Bigfoot may be.

Heading towards the close, we talk about Stan's career as a researcher beyond the '73/74 wave and start by getting his perspective on the evolution of the field of ufology in the ensuing four decades. He talks about what he sees as one of the bigger difficulties to emerge from the Internet age. Given his lengthy tenure in the field of ufology, we find out his perspective on the activist based disclosure style of ufology which has reemerged in the new millennium. We also find out if Stan has to deal with many prank callers or hoaxed cases on his UFO hotline.

Wrapping things up, we find out what keeps driving Stan after 50+ years investigating the UFO phenomenon. We revisit the Bigfoot and Stan speculate on whether will find out the ultimate answer to the creature and what that might be. Stan also tells us about his other book which was released in 2010, Really Mysterious Pennsylvania, including a case where a man was so close to a UFO that he almost touched it and a woman's tantalizing Bigfoot encounter. This segues into discussion of the reputation of the PA Bigfoot as aggressive and we learn how accurate that is, based on Stan's cases. Closing out the show, we find out what's next for Stan Gordon and how folks can pick up his two latest books.

BIOGRAPHY

Since 1965, Stan Gordon has been conducting on scene investigations of mysterious encounters in Pennsylvania. He has been involved with the examination of thousands of UFO and other strange reports from across the Keystone State. During the late 1960's, Stan acted as a telephone report sighting coordinator for the UFO Research Institute of Pittsburgh. Stan has been internationally recognized as an authority on the subject of the UFO and Bigfoot phenomena.

He gained prominence from his first hand investigation into the well remembered 1973 UFO/Bigfoot series of sightings and encounters which occurred in Pennsylvania. He founded the Westmoreland County UFO Study Group in 1970, which expanded to the Pennsylvania Center For UFO Research in 1975. In 1981 he founded the Pennsylvania Association For the Study Of The Unexplained.

Stan Gordon served as the Pennsylvania State Director of the Mutual UFO Network for many years and was the first recipient (1978) of the annual MUFON "Meritorious Achievement in A UFO Investigation Award." Stan also continues to investigate information concerning the controversial UFO crash/retrieval case which occurred on December 9, 1965 near Kecksburg in Pennsylvania and has been the primary investigator of the event for many years.

His website is stangordon.info.

SEASON 5

Topics Discussed:

• How Bruce first got interested in UFOs
• Early cases he investigated & the evolution of the field
• Ufology's 'paradigm shift' in the 1980's
• His longstanding 'rivalry' with debunker Phil Klass
• How the digital age has changed UFO photo analysis
• The importance of UFO documents gleaned from the government
• Famous cases like the McMinnville Photos, the 1978 New Zealand sightings, and the JAL case of 1986
• And Tons More ...

We kick things off by finding out how Bruce first got involved in researching the UFO phenomenon, way back in the late 1960's. He shares a great story about his first visit to the national NICAP office in Washington D.C. Bruce then takes us through the early cases he investigated when he first got involved in the subject. Bruce also talks about the fallout from the Condon Report of 1972 and some of the key cases of the 1973 UFO flap that followed the Condon Report.

Jumping back to Bruce's early years in Ufology, we find out what the mood was like during those days, especially in the wake of the Condon Report. Bruce details how the Condon Report mishandled the famous McMinnville photo case. Looking at the phenomenon as a whole, Bruce puts forward the notion that the very creation of the Condon Report suggests that there had to be some veracity to the UFO subject.

Looking at Bruce's personal opinion on the nature of UFOs, we find out what it was when he first got interested in the subject and how it has evolved over the last 40+ years. This leads to some insight into how NICAP felt about the UFO phenomenon and what factors may have contributed to that stance. He reflects on the "paradigm shift" in Ufology that happened in the early 1980's with the emergence of abduction research as well as the Roswell case. In the midst of this portion, Bruce shares the story of his grandmother's UFO sighting.

Bruce talks about why the Roswell case constituted a part of the big 1980's paradigm shift in Ufology, since it solidified the concept of a government cover-up of the UFO reality. Coupled with that, Bruce talks about how the early abductees were starkly different from the contactees of previous years. Bruce also talks about how crop circles evolved out of UFO landing trace cases first and then seemed to take on a more complex nature.

Going down a different rabbit hole, we talk about Bruce's numerous dealings with his frequent sparring partner, notorious UFO skeptic Phil Klass. Bruce talks about what made Phil Klass different from contemporary skeptics and provides a glimpse into the early years of Klass' skepticism of UFOs. We also get Bruce's opinion on the theory that Klass was doing his UFO debunking at the behest of the government. Bruce then details his investigation into the McMinnville photo case and how it led to a lengthy and elaborate exchange with Klass. Bruce also talks about his battles with Klass over the New Zealand UFO film case.

In light of the contemporary digital age, we get Bruce's opinion on the cloud of suspicion that befalls all modern UFO photos. Bruce extrapolates on his axiom "a photo does not a UFO make." This leads to some discussion on the JAL case of 1986. Part of this story includes an interesting detail about a critical error made by the infamous CSICOP. We then talk about Bruce's interaction with Rick Doty in the 1980's and the 1980 UFO case at Kirtland AFB that he investigated.

Since Bruce is so well known for his acquiring of FBI files on UFOs via the FOIA in the 1980's, we get his opinion on the sheer mass of documents that have been collected in the ensuing years and if we are at the point where we are overwhelmed with documents. Bruce contrasts the power of those documents then with the documents revealed in contemporary times and explains why it is important to amass these types of official government correspondence.

Heading towards the close, we ask Bruce what he thinks, based on his learned opinion, what he thinks is really going on with the UFO phenomenon and whether he thinks we'll ever find out the true answer about UFOs. Wrapping things up, we find out how Bruce views the field of Ufology after 40 years and where he thinks the UFO field needs to go in the future. And, finally, we wrap it up with what's next for Dr. Bruce Maccabee.

BIOGRAPHY

Dr. Bruce Maccabee received his Ph.D. in Physics from American University, Washington, D. C., in 1970. In 1972 commenced his long career at the Naval Surface Warfare Center, presently headquartered at Dahlgren, Virginia. He has worked on optical data processing, generation of underwater sound with lasers and various aspects of the Strategic Defense Initiative (SDI) and Ballistic Missile Defense (BMD) using high power lasers.

He has been active in UFO research since late 1960s when he joined the National Investigations Committee on Aerial Phenomena (NICAP) and was active in research and investigation for NICAP until its demise in 1980. He became a member of MUFON in 1975 and was subequently appointed to the position of state Director for Maryland, a position he still holds. In 1979 he was instrumental in establishing the Fund for UFO Research and was the chairman for the about 13 years. He presently serves on the National Board of the Fund.

Dr. Maccabee is the author or coauthor of about three dozen technical articles and more than a hundred UFO articles over the last 25 years, including many which appeared in the MUFON Journal and MUFON Symposium proceedings. He is co-author with Edward Walters of "UFOs Are Real, Here's The Proof," (Avon Books, 1997), he is the author of "The UFO/FBI Connection" (Llewellyn Books, May, 2000) and he is the author of novel, "Abduction in My Life," (November, 2000).

Dr. Bruce Maccabee.mp3

SEASON 5

7.3.10
526
Robert Hastings & Bob Salas
(2 Hr 28 Min.)

Topics Discussed:

• Bob Salas' 1967 UFO encounter at Malmstrom AFB
• An update from Robert on his UFO/Nuke research
• The duo's appearance on Larry King Live in 2008
• USOs & Nukes
• Nuclear Power Plants & UFOs
• Speculation on the UFO/Nuke Connection
• The media & UFOs
• The evolution of UFO/Nuke encounters
• The problem with skeptics
• Robert's interview with former Atomic Energy Commission chairman Chet Lytle
• The duo's planned press conference for September 27th in Washington, D.C.

We kick things off with an update from Robert Hastings on what he's been up to since his previous BoA:Audio appearance. We also have Robert Salas recount his famous March 1967 UFO encounter at Malmstrom Air Force Base. Given that he's probably told the story hundred, if not thousands, of times, we find out if Bob ever gets tired of recounting the events of that night in 1967. We find out, given the classifications involved, what made Bob decide to share his story with the world.

Comparing Bob's case to the types of incident reports that Robert has collected, we get a general overview of his research into the UFO-Nuke connection. We find out if Robert has gotten any reports from folks in the Navy who might have had USO or UFO encounters while working on nuclear submarines.

Delving into the latest project that Robert and Bob are working on, they discuss their planned press conference at the National Press Club in Washington, D.C., scheduled for September 27th. Bob details how the plan came together and what their goal is for the press conference. We get their reaction to the many UFO press conferences that have been held at the NPC since 2004 and if they think that will hinder their event. Robert stresses why the UFO-Nuke witnesses are particularly strong, since they were vetted by the US government to be responsible for nuclear weapons.

We get Robert's response to the theory that the UFOs seen over nuclear bases are part of some kind training exercise. Bob also shares his take on why this theory is implausible, based on his personal experience. We then discuss how the Air Force reaction to these events has changed over the years and if we can glean any information, from that, as to what their institutional perspective is on UFOs at nuclear bases. Going down a different road, we get Bob's perspective on being a prominent witness in Ufology and how he's reacted to the slings and arrows of skeptics, notably Bill Nye, who appeared as the designated skeptic to oppose Bob and Robert on the Larry King show.

Moving into other areas, we hear about Robert's 1998 interview with former Atomic Energy Commission chairman Chet Lytle, the stunning UFO revelations that he shared, and how he eventually stopped revealing information, under mysterious circumstances. Returning to discussion on the pair's appearance on Larry King, we find out how that opportunity even happened in the first place. We find out, from Bob Salas, what Larry King is like, off camera, with regards to the UFO phenomenon. Since this UFO-Nuke phenomenon has been ongoing for the last 40 years, at least, we find out if the military has found a way to prevent tampering of weapons via the craft, as was reported throughout the 1960's.

Getting into speculation, we wonder what the motivation is behind the UFOs hovering over nuclear bases, disarming weapons, and, in some cases, arming them. Keeping things within the speculative realm, we find out if there has been a downgrade of nuclear weapons due to the UFO 'warnings.' Continuing our look at the various 'other' forms of the UFO-Nuke connection, we find out what sort of reports that they have collected regarding nuclear power plants. We then talk about the need to realize that UFOs probably will not stop a nuclear war if one were to erupt and Robert also talks about situations where UFOs engaged nuclear weapons in the Soviet Union.

Heading towards the close, we have the duo reiterate the plan for the September Press Conference, they preview the event, and talk about the need for donations to help make the event possible. This segues into some discussion on the importance of emphasizing the national security implications of the UFO-Nuke connection, which may help engage the public and media in a more tangible way than other styles of 'disclosure attempts.' Wrapping things up, we find out what's next for Robert Hastings and Bob Salas, beyond the September 27th press conference.

BIOGRAPHY

Robert Hastings is a noted UFO researcher and lecturer who has interviewed nearly a hundred U.S. Air Force veterans who were involved in nuclear weapons-related UFO incidents. Robert has interviewed retired military personnel regarding their knowledge of nuclear weapons-related UFO activity, and has taken his findings and presented them to colleges and universities nationwide. He's also the author of the book UFOs and Nukes.

Captain Bob Salas graduated from the Air Force Academy and spent seven years in active duty from 1964 to 1971. He also held positions at Martin Marietta and Rockwell and spent 21 years at the FAA. In the Air Force, he was an air traffic controller and a missile launch officer as well as an engineer on the Titan 3 missiles.

Robert Hastings and Bob Salas.mp3

SEASON 5

6.15.10
524
Paul Stonehill
(2 Hr 16 Min.)

Topics Discussed:

• The Soviet UFO phenomenon and research community
• Key cases in Soviet UFO history
• The evolution of Ufology in the Soviet Union
• How the government and military reactions to the phenomenon have changed over the years
• Media coverage of the UFO enigma
• Soviet USOs
• Testimony of Russian cosmonauts about aliens
• "Space whispers"
• The mysterious humanoids of Lake Baikal
• The Tunguska Incident
• The Veronezh Case
• Chinese Ufology
• Mars' moonlet Phobos

We kick things off with Paul diving right into Soviet Ufology and explaining why the former USSR is a unique case amongst the many nations that have experienced the UFO phenomenon. He talks about the official Soviet UFO study group, from 1979 to 1990, which was split into two factions, one controlled by the military and one controlled by scientists. This segues into Paul telling us about a pioneering Soviet Ufologist from the Stalin era and the tale of an archaeological find, from the 1950's, which may have been a microchip recovered from a UFO. This story leads to Paul musing about Russia's interest in Mars' moon Phobos. He also speculates on why UFOs seem to have had an interest in the Soviet Union.

Pulling things back around, we get the bio/background on Paul Stonehill, how he became interested in the UFO phenomenon, and how he ended up leaving the USSR to come to America. He reflects on the early information he found on UFOs and how it was more "pure" before the fall of the Soviet Union. We then discuss perhaps the most famous Soviet UFO event ever: the Tunguska Incident and Paul shares his insight into what he thinks happened in 1908, based on his research into the infamous event. Paul explains why he thinks there were two objects involved in the Tunguska incident, the legends surrounding the area, and the potential after effects of the event. He then details the evolution of scientific interest in the Tunguska event by Russian researchers.

Our conversation then turns towards a major phenomenon that Paul has researched: Russian USO cases. He talks about the Soviet Navy's study on USOs, how it was conducted, and how it mysteriously ended. He also talks about one famous Soviet UFO researcher who was protected by the Russian Navy and even tasked with researching the USOs. He also shares the story of a chilling form of USOs called "croakers" which were pestering Russian submarines. Paul also refutes the story from last year which claimed that Russia was declassifying its UFO files and explains why it is highly unlikely that Russia will release its information.

We then cover the mysterious Lake Baikal which local legend claimed housed a castle at the bottom of it and was home to the "Ruler of the Universe." Paul talks about an early 1980's military expedition to Lake Baikal after humanoid creatures were seen operating beneath the surface. Paul also shares the story of a UFOs monitoring a lake in Russia, a weapons test site, and almost launching Soviet nuclear weapons in 1982. Paul shares a story of an attempted Russian shootdown of a UFO and the response from those higher in the military chain of command.

Paul talks about one of the key moments in Soviet Ufological history: the 1967 creation of a short-lived officially sanctioned civilian UFO group that worked with parts of the military and called for people who had UFO sightings. He explains what precipitated this group's creation as well as the intelligence reasons for wanting a UFO group. He also introduces an interesting irony surrounding secret Soviet craft and UFOs. He also details how the next wave of official government UFO research began, 11 years later, in 1978 with the Siekta programs. He talks about the event that necessitated the creation of the Sietka program and why it suggests something deeper at work beyond covering up secret projects.

The conversation then turns towards the cosmonauts and what they say that they have seen from space. Paul notes, Pavel Popovic, one of the most important Soviet cosmonauts to help Ufology in the USSR and some of his testimony about UFO sightings and information. Paul shares some of the information that cosmonauts have revealed such as sightings of undersea bases and strange UFO and USO-type phenomenon. He talks about some stunning testimony of cosmonauts who said that they had "angels" appear aboard the space station and the recurring "whispers in space" that have been heard by cosmonauts. This leads to some discussion on Popovic's search for Roswell files in the Soviet Union, the cryptic response he got and Paul's take on where those files were probably sent.

Looking at another major UFO case in the USSR, we talk about the Voronezh case from 1989. He explains why the Voronezh Case seemed to burst on the scene, why the year 1989 is important in Soviet Ufological history, and how the area around Voronezh has a rich history of UFO sightings. He also notes how the case has additional veracity because of the culture of Russia in 1989. He also talks about a very intriguing case of a recovered object in 1986 that Mikhail Gorbachev wanted to go and see and had to re-arrange his travels plans to do so.

Revisiting the history of Soviet Ufology, we find out what has been going on in Russia since 1990, when the Sietka programs shut down, and how Russian Ufology is shaping up today. This leads to some discussion on Chinese Ufology and Paul details what he has learned about the scene in that country. He speculates on what the Chinese government's attitude about sharing UFO information might be and how there does seem to be some cooperation between China and Russia on space programs. He also reflects on times when America and Russia grew closer during the Cold War and then tensions grew between the nations once again. Ultimately, he speculates on the nature of a global "working group" amongst all nations with UFO information.

Heading towards the close, we look at Soviet Ufology as a mirror to American UFO studies, we find out if the USSR also had a spate of abductions and experienced the abduction phenomenon. Similarly, Paul talks about how the USSR actually had translated versions of books by American debunkers brought to the country to dissuade people from being interested in UFOs. Finally, we find out what the general attitude in the public and media is with regards to UFOs in the Russia. Wrapping up our conversation, we find out what's next for Paul Stonehill and where people can get his books.

BIOGRAPHY

Paul Stonehill was born in Kiev, USSR, in 1959 and emigrated to the U.S. in 1972. In his youth, Paul helped smuggle people out from behind the iron curtain, aided dissidents, and smuggled banned literature into the USSR. He graduated from California State University with a BA in Political Science and wrote a thesis on the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. Paul has worked as journalist covering warfare as well as freelancing on stories about UFO and Anomalous Phenomena. In October of 1993, OMNI Magazine featured a story about Paul's work, and the Russian Ufology Research Center, which he created back in 1991. After the fall of Communism, his articles were published throughout Russia and the Ukraine. Since 1989, Paul has consulted for American television and motion picture production companies, as well as corporate entities. His areas of expertise are: Russian history; Soviet covert operations; corporate security issues for expatriate workers; warfare in the former USSR; cross-cultural training; anomalous phenomena in the Eastern Europe, Russia, Central Asia, and China. His website is healingsofatlantis.com.

Paul Stonehill.mp3

SEASON 5

5.14.10
520
Richard Dolan
(2 Hr 12 Min.)

Topics Discussed:

• An in-depth discussion on Richard's long-awaited study of UFO history from 1973 to 1991, UFOs and the National Security State, Vol. II.
• The evolution of UFO studies from 73 to 91
• How crash retrieval and abduction research proved to be a revolution for the field
• The APRO v. NICAP v. MUFON feud
• "Government-made UFOs"
• The concept of a "breakaway civilization"
• The controversial Bill Cooper
• Richard's decision to include his "contributions" to Ufology in the book
• The perceived "taint" of the Doty-era of UFO studies
• The mind-blowing testimony of the all-too-unknown Dr. Eric Walker.

We kick things off by taking a general look at the era of 1973 to 1991 for UFO studies, how the field looked when it first started and the massive evolution that took place over those 20 years. Richard tells us why he now looks at the big picture of Ufology as pre & post Internet. This leads to some discussion on the perceived taint of some of the 1980's research in Ufology as much of it, now in retrospect, hangs under a massive cloud of doubt due to known interference by people like Rick Doty, who were actively disinforming the community. Richard makes the case that there must be some nuggets of true information in that disinformation, by the very nature of disinformation itself. Richard also details how this situation is part of a key theory from his book: that the government "fought back" against UFO studies in the 1980's as the field began to make progress and get stronger.

Moving down a whole different avenue of discussion, we cover Richard's investigation, in the book, of the "ours v. theirs" debate regarding UFO craft and how taht debate holds up, in retrospect, based on what we now know of the leading technology of the time. This segues into discussion on what Richard thinks is the single theme that emerged from his writing the book: the concept of a "breakaway civilization" of those "in the know" about UFOs. We talk about the potential dangers of this "breakaway civilization" in that it would create a separate race of people who were far advanced of "average" humans in knowledge and consciousness. Looking at one of the many cases profiled in the book, we talk about the Hudson Valley UFO flap of the early 1980's and Richard talks about why it was like the "perfect storm" for Ufology.

Next we examine some of the trials and tribulations of the people involved in Ufology during the 1973 to 1991 era, beginning with the formation of MUFON which was an organization that formed as a breakaway group from APRO. Richard talks about how APRO founder Coral Lorenzen reacted to the formation of MUFON and what she was like as the leader of APRO. We also talk about J. Allen Hynek's role in this era of Ufology, how he was a polarizing figure in a number of ways and how Hynek's group CUFOS had an acrimonious relationship with both MUFON and APRO. On the plus side, Richard credits Hynek for being a champion for "scientific Ufology." We also look back at how the folding of NICAP created a vacuum, of sorts, out of which MUFON and CUFOS formed, much to the chagrin of APRO. Richard reflects on how CUFOS was the "conservative wing" of UFO studies, avoiding crash retrieval and abduction research.

This leads to some discussion on how crash retrieval research sparked a revolution of thinking in UFO studies as, to accept it, obliterates the old paradigm of "foul up v. cover up" which was the dominant debate in UFO studies for decades. He also talks about how the emergence of abduction research in the 1980's also added a new layer onto the discourse of the time and how Budd Hopkins' work ended up swaying some of the conservative Ufologists into, at least, looking at the evidence. We then talk about Richard's inclusion, in the book, of characters like Bill Cooper and John Lear, researchers who put forth a lot of controversial material in the late 1980's. He talks about how he wrestled with the portrayal of these controversial figures and their "contributions" to the field. He specifically talks about the notorious Bill Cooper and shares his take on the veracity of Cooper's research. We then look at another big theme from the book: the transition from nationalism to a more global society and how the UFO subject & cover up fits into that new paradigm.

Tackling another meme which has been a part of Ufology since the beginning, we talk about the "impending disclosure" concept. Richard discusses how this idea pops up every decade in Ufology, if not once then several times. Surprisingly, he takes a more positive look at this trend and explains why people should find hope in the meme, rather than being disheartened by the constant failures to achieve UFO disclosure. This leads to some general discussion on UFO disclosure and Richard addresses the challenges of revealing the secret. He also talks about the alleged US government's 1991 attempt at UFO disclosure, why Richard believes that it truly happened. He also reveals a new project, that he is co-authoring, which will look at the disclosure issue and should arrive later this year. He also talks about why there is not motivation for governments to release the UFO truth but, also, why he thinks that UFO disclosure is inevitable.

Looking at some of the interesting anecdotes found in UFOs and the National Security State, Vol. II, we first examine Colonel John Alexander's UFO Working Group of the 1980's, what it was and what Richard thinks its goals were. We then talk about one of the more romanticized stories in Ufology's history: The Aviary. Richard talks about what it was and clears up some of the confusion that has developed about the group over the years. We then find out about Dr. Erik Walker and the major revelations he made about MJ-12 and the nature of the UFO cover-up. Richard details how Walker's information came to light, speculates on the veracity of that information and why it seems to be pretty strong information. He also tells us about the "coded letter" that Erik walker wrote and that has never been decoded.

Heading towards the close, we examine another big theme of the book: that the UFO secret may have moved from being kept by the government to being kept by private corporations. Richard explains why this probably happened and what it means for UFO secrecy. Richard also speculates on what the contemporary version of an MJ-12 like group would actually look like and it is far different from the "classic MJ-12" concept.

Looking ahead to UFOs and the National Security State, Vol. III, which will bring his study up to the present day, we find out from Richard how he handles the challenges of writing a history book when the subject is so fresh as well as aspects of which will, by the nature of his recent work, also include himself. Taking one last look at the issue of UFO studies, we talk about how there seems to have been a massive shift in the public perception of the UFO phenomenon in recent years. Closing out this marathon conversation, we find out what's next for Richard Dolan, including an impending new book due out later this Fall and the expected release time for Vol. III.

BIOGRAPHY

Richard M. Dolan was born in Brooklyn, New York, in 1962. He holds an MA in History from the University of Rochester and a BA in History from Alfred University. He earned a Certificate in Political Theory from Oxford University and was a Rhodes Scholar finalist. Prior to his interest in anomalous phenomena, Dolan studied US Cold War strategy, Soviet history, and international diplomacy.In 2000, he published UFOs and the National Security State: An Unclassified History, 1941-1973 (republished in 2002 with the subtitle Chronology of a Cover-Up, 1941-1973). This 500-page history provides clear detail on the major UFO cases of the early Cold War era, the attitudes and policies toward UFOs by the military and intelligence community, and the fascinating development of the citizen movements to end UFO secrecy. In 2009, Richard completed Volume Two of his historical study, subtitled The Cover-Up Exposed, 1973-1991, and is now at work on the final volume of his historical trilogy He has also published articles and spoken at conferences around the world. Among his main themes are the destruction of our political liberties as a result of the UFO cover-up. He has also speculated on the possible nature of the non-humans themselves and what their presence here means for our civilization. This has led him to take a fresh approach to the topic of “Exopolitics” and to develop unique insights into the practical challenges and opportunities for a true disclosure of the UFO phenomenon. Richard has done a great deal of television work, having appeared on many documentaries for the History Channel, Sci Fi Channel, BBC, and elsewhere. In 2006 he was host to a six-episode series for the Sci Fi Channel, called SciFi Investigates. His website is keyholepublishing.com.

Richard Dolan.mp3

SEASON 5

12.23.09
505
Stanton Friedman
(1 hr 54 min.)

Topics discussed:

• We welcome the "Father of Modern Day Ufology" Stanton Friedman for the 5th Annual BoA:Audio Holiday Special
• What he's been up to this last year
• A teaser for his next book 'Science Is Wrong'
• The passing of Ufological legend Dick Hall
• What Stanton sees as his own legacy in the world of UFO studies
• The Exopolitical movement
• The "disclosure meme"
• Questions sent in from BoA:Audio listeners
• 9/11
• UFOs as self-replicating probes
• The JFK assassination
• The Nazi "Bell" experiments
• The oddest thing he's encountered on an investigation
• The Norway spiral
• UFO cases he sees as particularly strong
• The nuclear plane program he used to work on
• His thoughts on the "inter-dimensional" theories on UFOs,

We kick things off by finding out what Stan has been up to since last year's Holiday Special and he gives us a teaser of his upcoming book Science was Wrong. He talks about some of the "incorrect science" that is covered in the book such as the saga of Ignaz Semmelwies and the many previous false proclamations about the limitations of flight. This segues into Stan weighing in on Climate Gate.

Moving into UFO discussion, we get Stan's thoughts on Ufology pioneer Dick Hall's passing this past Summer. He also reflects on some of the disagreements that he had with Hall over the years and also shares an instance where Hall's criticism of Friedman's work on Shoot Them Down led to Stan improving the research into the book.

This leads to us really smashing the 4th wall as we find out what Stan sees as his own legacy in the world of UFO studies. One aspect that he focuses on is the sense of appreciation he feels from average people who are thankful that he is talking about UFOs in the mainstream media and has been for so long. He also talks about how his legacy will forever be tied to Roswell and MJ-12 and goes on to talk about how he is still embroiled in the MJ-12 debate even today. Stan also refutes recent claims by MUFON president James Carrion regarding the Roswell event not being a crashed flying saucer but actually disinformation. He also talks about his style of "getting information," not just finding witnesses but asking the right questions.

We revisit the period of Ufology which has been on Binnall's mind the last few months, the early 1970's, and get Stan's take on what looks like the nadir for serious UFO research. This leads to Stan talking about that era and, in particular, the problems that Bob Bigelow ran into when he tried to help some of the UFO organizations of that era. This leads to some discussion on the ever-emerging Exopolitics movement and Stan shares his take on those who think disclosure is imminent. We also talk about what may be a misguided view of present affairs by those who think disclosure is right around the corner, and the recent stuff coming out of the Vatican with regards to aliens. Wrapping up Binnall's questions, we get Stan's general opinion on where the UFO secret stands at the end of 2009 and how the press coverage of UFOs seems to be improving.

The second half of the interview is devoted to questions sent in by BoA:Audio listeners and members of theusofe.com. The first question asks for Stan's opinion on the 911 / NWO conspiracy and any possible relationship it may have had to UFOs. Stan uses this question to introduce an intriguing conspiracy theory of his own. The next question gets Stan's opinion on the possibility that UFOs are Von Nuemann probes and not "flesh and blood aliens." The next question asks Stan if he's ever dreamed of the Roswell crash, since he's spent so long researching it.

Next we find out about Stan's opinion on the Kennedy assassination and where he was when he found out that Kennedy had been shot. After that, we find out about Stan's schedule nowadays and if he is starting to settle down after so many extensive years giving presentations on UFOs. This leads to some discussion on the many peripheral activities that Stan does when he goes somewhere to give a lecture. We next get Stan's take on the Nazi Bell experiments and this leads to him also talking about the "it's ours" argument that many people put forth with regards to contemporary UFO sightings.

Thanks to the next question, we find out what was the most unsettling experience Stan has had while out on an investigation. The following question is whether Stan thinks the government will ever "come clean" on Roswell and San Augustin. Getting more recent, we find out what Stan thinks of the Norway Spiral that was big news in early December. We next find out what other key UFO cases Stan would have liked to have been studying from day one, if he had the chance.

Heading towards the close, we get Stan's recollections on why the nuclear rocket business never ended up moving forward after he'd worked in the industry. Wrapping up the listener questions, we get Stan's opinion on the "interdimensional hypothesis" that has come into vogue in the last few years. Closing out the conversation, we find out what's next for Stanton Friedman as we move into 2010.

BIOGRAPHY

Stanton T. Friedman received B.S. and M.S. degrees in physics from the University of Chicago in 1955 and 1956. He was employed for 14 years as a nuclear physicist for such companies as GE, GM, Westinghouse, TRW Systems, Aerojet General Nucleonics, and McDonnell Douglas on such advanced, classified, eventually cancelled, projects as nuclear aircraft, fission and fusion rockets, and nuclear powerplants for space.

He has provided written testimony to Congressional Hearings, appeared twice at the UN, and been a pioneer in many aspects of Ufology including Roswell, Majestic 12, the Betty Hill-Marjorie Fish star map work; analysis of the Delphos, Kansas, physical trace case; crashed saucers, flying saucer technology and challenges to the S.E.T.I. (Silly Effort to Investigate) cultists.

He is the author of the books TOP SECRET/MAJIC and Crash at Corona: The Definitive Study of the Roswell Incident, the co-author Captured, about the Betty and Barney Hill abduction case, and recently penned his "magnum opus," Flying Saucers and Science.

His website is stantonfriedman.com.

Stanton T. Friedman.mp3

SEASON 5

12.9.09
503
Peter Davenport
(1 hr 30 min.)

Topics discussed:

• The National UFO Reporting center and the world of Ufology
• Updates on his move to a decommissioned missile site in Washington state
• What has been going on with the NUFORC
• How he became director of the NUFORC in 1994
• How the hotline has changed in the last 15 years
• The pros and cons of both the emergence of the Internet as well as cell phones
• His dealings with other UFO groups
• Coverage of UFOs by the mainstream media
• Noteworthy trends and cases from the last few years
• Peter's 1997 meeting with government officials

We roll right into our conversation by first getting Peter's perspective on the changing landscape of UFO report collection and he reacts to what he sees as a disturbing trend of people taking cases from the NUFORC and acting as if they were the ones who collected the report. He also talks about what makes the NUFORC special, such as their strong endorsement from the FAA and local police departments as well as the open sharing of reports on their website. Before we really dive into discussion of the NUFORC, we get an update from Peter about his big move to an abandoned missile site in Washington state and what he would like to do with the property in the future.

We then begin discussion of the NUFORC, starting at the beginning of Peter's tenure as director with him recounting how he first ended up being the director of the National UFO Reporting Center in 1994. Peter talks about his initial days as director and how the incoming calls far outweighed his original expectations. We also talk about what has motivated Peter to keep running the hotline after all these years and he reflects on the sacrifices, both financial and time wise, he has made over the years. This segues into some discussion on just how many people actually write down their UFO sighting and why that is an essential step that anyone who has seen a UFO should take. This segues into a discussion on how many of the reports that Peter gets nowadays are poorly written. As such, we then find out from Peter what is the ideal information to include in a UFO report.

The conversation then turns to the evolution of the NUFORC, starting with how the hotline was set-up back in 1994. This leads to discussion on how the Internet has affected both Ufology as well as the NUFORC. Peter weighs the pros and cons of the Internet with regards to the NUFORC. Peter also reflects on some of the difficulties with other folks who don't want to reciprocate the sharing of UFO reports. We also get an update on the ongoing problem of prank callers inundating the NUFORC. He also puts forth what he sees should be the national policy on cell phones to help alleviate the problem of prank calls.

We move on to discuss a remarkable, recent case covered on the NUFORC website: an August 15th, 2009 series of UFO sightings that spanned 11 states. We also reflect on why this remarkable series of UFO sightings were not covered in either the mainstream media or the underground, esoteric media. Peter also recalls how these nights of multiple case reports are not a wholly unique occurrence. This leads to some discussion on the media's lack of coverage of UFOs and Peter reflects on some of his troubles in dealing with the media, notably the Chicago Tribune and their coverage of the O'Haire UFO event. Peter also recalls the night of the Stephenville UFO sighting and what the scene was like at the NUFORC that evening.

Up next we cover a fascinating story from Peter's career: his 1997 meeting with members of the US government who were interested in the information he's collected at the NUFORC. In tremendous detail, he recounts the story of how it came about and speculates on why the government wanted to talk to him in the first place. He also reveals some stunning information imparted to him by the government agents who requested the meeting as well as a mindboggling question they asked him about the UFO phenomenon. He also shares the specific sort of cases which piqued the government's interest enough to organize this meeting.

Following that, we talk about the ongoing UFO file releases that have been happening all over the world and we get Peter's opinion on why the US seems to be the one holdout on such file releases. Heading towards the close, we look at another interesting case that Peter has received since our last interview, Peter talks about a November 4th, 2008 "car mutilation," which saw a vehicle disfigured in an odd fashion by a mysterious force. Images of the car can be seen here (scroll down a bit and you'll see them). He also shares some interesting recent information about what happened to all the evidence from this case.

Wrapping things up, we find out if Peter has an endgame in mind as to his future as director of the NUFORC and how the lack of an endgame plan for researchers is a systemic problem throughout Ufology.

BIOGRAPHY

Peter Davenport, Director of the National UFO Reporting Center since July 1994, was born in St. Louis, Missouri, where he lived to the age of 14. As a boy, he attended high school in St. Louis, Ethiopia, and New Hampshire.

Peter received his undergraduate education at Stanford University in California, where he earned bachelor's degrees in both Russian and biology, and a translator's certificate in Russian. His graduate education was completed at the University of Washington in Seattle, where he earned an M.S. degree in the genetics and biochemistry of fish from the College of Fisheries, as well as an M.B.A. degree in finance and international business from the Graduate School of Business.

He has worked as a college instructor, a commercial fisherman, a Russian translator in the Soviet Union, a fisheries observer aboard Soviet fishing vessels, a flight instructor (gliders), and a businessman. Peter was the founding president of a Seattle-based biotechnology company, which, at one time, employed over 300 scientists and technicians.

Peter has had an active interest in the UFO phenomenon from his early boyhood. He experienced his first UFO sighting over the St. Louis municipal airport in the summer of 1954, and he investigated his first UFO case during the summer of 1965 in Exeter, New Hampshire. Peter has been witness to several anomalous events, possibly UFO related, including a dramatic sighting over Baja California in February 1990, and several nighttime sightings over Washington State during 1992.

In addition to being the Director of the National UFO Reporting Center, Peter is a current member of MUFON, and is a former Co-State Section Director (King County), and former Director of Investigation, for the Washington State chapter of MUFON.

His website is www.ufocenter.com.

Peter Davenport.mp3

SEASON 4

8.27.09
433
Budd Hopkins
(2 hr 8 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Budd's remarkable and epic life
• His career as an artist and his relationship with his father
• Early influences on his artistic career
• Artists and their disinterest in politics
• Budd's near-fight with Jack Kerouac
• Why he chose to change mediums from paint to sculpture
• Why he dubbed some of his work to be 'failures'
• The problem with museums today
• and much much more
• The second half focuses, of course, on Budd's pioneering work in the field of abduction research
• How hearing the War of the Worlds shaped the populace who heard it (including a young Budd Hopkins)
• Why the nature of ET interaction went from 'contactees' to 'abductees,'
• The concept of 'confirmation anxiety' and how it effects abductees
• His take on the 'ETs as robots' theory
• The nature of hybrid revelations to abductees and if it is an ongoing process or a one time thing
• Some insight into the Shirley MacLain meeting that is detailed in the book
• Framing the UFO/ET questions for the mass public in this modern time (i.e. Ufology's Public Relations problem)
• The portrayal of abductions in mass media
• and much much more

We kick things off by finding out what made Budd decide to write a memoir and he details the evolution of book as he wrote it over the last decade or so. To that end, he specifically talks about the "Dodging Hits" chapter of the book and why he included it in the memoir.

We then begin discussion on Budd's career as an artist, beginning with how he drew inspiration at a very early age from his art classes and tasks of drawing tropical fish. He reflects on how these fish, along with his experience as a child going to the 1940 World's Fair, would later emerge in his artistic work. Staying within the realm of Budd's childhood and upbringing, we talk about his fascinating and complex relationship with his father and how he handled discussing it in the book.

Looking at another observation from Budd in the book, we discuss how he noted that his artist friends of the 1950's were wholly uninterested in the world of politics, which he found intriguing and surprising. We then contrast this with the attitude in esoterica, where the opposite seems true and interest in politics often far outweighs interest in entertainment. This segues into a discussion on the literal "state of art" in contemporary times, where painting gives way to 500 channel cable systems. Budd smashes the 4th wall and muses about how the content of his memoir (Art and UFOs) fits into this paradigm of shifting interests.

Having Budd share one of the many stories from Art, Life, and UFOs, he recounts his near-fight with Jack Kerouac and how it exemplified the divide between the 1950's artists of NYC and the then-emerging Beat Poets. Budd also shares a remarkably synchronistic coda to the story, which happened just a few weeks ago. We then look at a big sea change in Budd's career as an artist, when he switched from painting to sculpture as his predominant artistic style and we find out what inspired that dramatic shift in medium.

Budd extrapolates more on the story in the book where he tells Mark Motherwell that one of his 'Spanish Elegy' paintings is a "failure" and also what he meant when he said he destroyed 11 of his older paintings because he considered them to be "failures" as well.

Heading towards the close of the art portion of the interview, we find out why Budd's works are not featured prominently in most, if not all, museums that own pieces of work from him. Budd shares some enlightening insight into the shocking state of museums today. Forming a bridge from the art discussion to the UFO portion of the interview, we discuss Budd's observation, in the book, that New Age enthusiasts seem to gravitate towards the darker Egyptian and Mayan art as opposed to the more humanistic, and less rigid, Greek art. Budd speculates on what this says about New Age beliefs and draws parallels between the coldness of Egyptian art and the reports from abductees.

Beginning our discussion on Budd's UFO and abduction research, we start by going way back to the original Orson Welles' radio broadcast of War of the Worlds (which was heard by a young Budd Hopkins) and how it had a profound effect of the belief in UFOs by not just Budd but the vast majority of Americans at the time.

We then discuss how and why Budd's interest in UFOs led him towards looking into abductions, especially since when he first started investigating them, there literally wasn't a field of abduction research and he did a great deal of pioneering work at the very beginnings of that branch of esoterica. We then get Budd's take on the stark difference between the contactee era of Ufology and the abductee era and why he thinks such a change in ET interaction reports took place. Budd does a masterful job of comparing and contrasting the two separate realms of ET interaction. He also discusses the nature of screen memories and how these may be able to be applied to classic contactee stories.

Budd extrapolates on the concept of 'confirmation anxiety" which effects many abductees when they realize that they were, almost certainly, abducted by aliens. Budd provides a riveting example of one such abductee's experience with 'confirmation anxiety.' We also get Budd's opinion on the theory of 'ETs as robots' and his thoughts on why it seems like the abductors sometimes make simple mistakes such as re-dressing the abductees incorrectly.

Looking at another phrase that Budd has coined based on his years of abduction research, we find out if 'presentation memories' (where female abductees are 'introduced' to their hybrid off-spring) are one-time occurrences or if they continue to happen to the abductee. We discuss Budd's meeting with Shirley MacLaine that is detailed in Art, Life, and UFOs and he elucidates a bit more on why there were a number of high ranking politicians with MacLaine during the meeting.

We then tackle the issue of Ufology's PR problem and discuss Budd's poignant and powerful axiom that "the quantity of evidence behind this extraordinary phenomenon requires an extraordinary investigation" as a counter to Carl Sagan's demand that "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." This leads to a discussion about re-framing the UFO question to the general public by asking them to investigate UFOs instead of simply telling them what UFOs are or trying to coerce them into believing the phenomenon is real. The leads to some criticism from Budd for the Exopolitical movement's methods of presenting UFO claims as facts.

Since Budd was at the ground floor of the abduction research community and really was one of the sparks that lit the explosion of abduction interest in the 1980's, we get him to reflect on how he think the portrayal of the phenomenon has evolved over the last 30 years. He responds to the poor portrayal of the phenomenon by the infamous Peter Jennings UFO special and muses about why abductions are a "tough sell" to the public because they are a particularly unsettling phenomenon. We also have Budd reflect on the evolution of abduction research over the last 30 years and why it seems like the next generation's Hopkins/Mack/Jacobs has yet to come into prominence in esoterica as a whole.

Based on his lengthy research into abductions and how they have seemingly evolved over the course of his investigation, we ponder what the 'next step' may be if this is an ongoing program of sorts. We also have Budd contrast the field of abduction research which now, after 30 years, seems to stand beside Ufology as opposed to existing on the peripheral of the field.

Tackling some larger issues and theories that surround abductions, we get Budd's take on the longstanding rumor that the government made some kind of deal with the ETs that allowed them to continue abducting people in exchange for technology. This leads to some discussion on Col. Corso and Budd's problems with his story. We also get Budd to weigh in on the 'alien implant' theory that is often a part of abduction research.

Closing out the interview, we find out what's next for Budd Hopkins, where folks can get Art, Life, and UFOs, and the best way to acquire some of his artwork.

BIOGRAPHY

Budd Hopkins is a world-renowned artist, author, and pioneer UFO abduction researcher. Having investigated well over 700 cases, he now heads the Intruders Foundation, a nonprofit, scientific research and support organization. Taken together, his three books, Missing Time, 1981, Intruders, 1987, and Witnessed, 1996, are widely regarded by researchers and skeptics alike as comprising the most influential series of books yet published on the abduction phenomenon. These works, Hopkins' lectures, and his other presentations have been responsible for bringing a number of other noted researchers-David Jacobs, John Carpenter, Yvonne Smith, and John Mack, among others-into this extraordinary area of specialization. His documented discoveries have become the basis of most later abduction investigations and research.

Hopkins' goal has always been to bring an objective, dispassionate scientific intelligence to bear on the UFO abduction phenomenon. To this end, he founded the Intruders Foundation (IF) in 1989. IF is a nonprofit organization devoted to research and public education concerning this extraordinary enigma. They publish a respected journal, as well as offer a nationwide referral service for those wishing to explore their own suspected abduction experiences.

Despite its extremely controversial nature, Hopkins' research has received serious commentary in such mainstream publications as Time, Paris Match, The Washington Post, The New York Times, The New York Review of Books, Omni, People, and Cosmopolitan. He has been a guest on hundreds of television and radio programs including Nightline, Good Morning America, The Today Show, The Oprah Winfrey Show, The Tonight Show, Charlie Rose, Larry King Live, The Charles Grodin Show, Sally Jesse Raphael, The Geraldo Rivera Show, 20/20, 48 Hours, Unsolved Mysteries, Encounters, A Current Affair, Nightwatch, The Late Show, The Art Bell Show, Tom Snyder, The Laura Lee Show, Hieronimus and Company, Weekend Edition (National Public Radio), Voice of America, Armed Forces Radio, numerous BBC affiliates, and many other shows and forums.

His website is www.intrudersfoundation.org

Budd Hopkins.mp3

SEASON 4

8.10.09
431
Timothy Good
(2 hr 20 min.)

Topics discussed:

• His latest book Need to Know
• A number of elements of the UFO phenomenon which he has uncovered in his lengthy career
• Early intelligence conflicts between the US and UK with regards to the Swedish 'Ghost Rockets' wave of the 1930's
• Winston Churchill's failed attempts to find out about UFOs from the MoD
• The story of Polish biophysicists and their visit to JPL where they saw remains of a dead alien possibly from Roswell
• Information that Good has received about alien bases located around the world and what their purpose might be
• The ongoing, secret conflict between Earth and alien races
• Stories of retaliation by UFOs against planes that challenged them, the concept of "gradual disclosure" of the UFO phenomenon
• The MJ-12 papers
• Good's role in their publication and what he really thinks was going on back in the 1980's when they were released
• The state of Ufology in general
• Plus, of course, tons and tons more

We kick things off by finding out how Timothy Good first got interested in the UFO phenomenon. We then talk a bit about how Timothy has had some amazing sources over the years and he reflects on how one works with getting such information, especially bit and pieces over long periods of time.

We then dive into some areas of discussion from Good's latest book Need to Know, beginning with how the US and UK had a rather chilly relationship with regards to UFOs during the 1946's Swedish 'Ghost Rocket' flap. This leads to some discussion on if that relationship changed over time and makes a startling revelation about US control over the UK's nuclear weapons. Timothy goes on to tell us further about Sweden's 'Ghost Rocket' flap of 1946 and why the UFOs probably weren't Soviet V1 rockets. We next talk about Winston Churchill's failed attempts to get UFO information from the UK MOD. This leads to some discussion on the early 1950's "UFO Working Party" in the UK, a precursor, of sorts, to Project Blue Book.

Timothy talks about information he has received about Polish biophysicists who were first tasked with examining a piece of UFO wreckage and were, later, shown parts of a dead alien inside the secret lower levels of JPL in 1977. The story includes some interesting information regarding the blood of these particular aliens. We then cover what Timothy has learned about alien bases being located throughout the world and he shares information he's received since he first published these revelations. This leads to us talking about the aliens, themselves, and Timothy explains how there are different types of aliens with different agenda and histories of dealing with the human race. He talks about what may be the agenda behind the abductions and how there are conflicting perspectives on it, depending on whether you look at it from humans or aliens' point of view.

Segueing from there, we muse about how deeply US interaction with ETs has been over the years, is there a working arrangement, hostility, etc. We then discuss the concept of "Needing to Know" and how that may be seemingly completely arbitrary depending on time and place. We ponder the concept of "gradual disclosure" and how it seems like the process has been almost too gradual. This leads to us finding out what happened between his previous book Unearthly Disclosure and his latest book Need to Know that made him change his mind about how UFO disclosure should unfold. We find out more about the conflict that has been ongoing with the US (and other nations) and the ETs.

We next hear about the W56 group out of Italy, which is a fascinating story of human / ET interaction. Timothy shares stories, as told by Stephano Brecia in the book Mass Contacts, of ETs taking humans to their underground bases, a humorous tale of an ET trying to drive a car, and how the ETs got food for their base in Italy.

Following that, we get Timothy's perspective on what seems to be the changing face of UFOs over the years, from balls of light to cigar shape to saucer shape to black triangles. Timothy shares his advice on how to tell if a UFO is "one of ours or one of theirs." He talks about joint operations between US jets and UFOs as well as information he has received about how extensive the UFO knowledge is inside the Air Force Office of Special Investigations (AFOSI). We also get Timothy to expand on his statement in Need to Know that he is certain that the Bermuda Triangle phenomenon is involved with UFOs as well as find out his thoughts on a potential Puerto Rico / UFO connection.

This leads to a sidebar about the importance of emphasizing official statements about UFOs from high ranking and highly respected people such as Edgar Mitchell and, more recently, Col. Charles Halt regarding the Bentwaters Incident. We then talk about the popular notion of ETs on the moon and Mars and get Timothy's take on these ideas.

Our conversation then moves further into the 'war' between UFOs and Earth and how it seems like this is one aspect of the phenomenon that Ufology does not want to discuss. This leads to us talking about the ETH and how Timothy endorses it "with qualifications" and challenges the notion of what is "extraterrestrial" if not just something from outside of Earth and, if 'ETs' were here first, then they are not really 'extraterrestrials.'

Moving back into Need to Know, we cover one of the more interesting stories in the book: a richly detailed alien contact story from an Air Force reserve, Sid Patrick, in 1965. Timothy recounts the story with remarkable detail and draw some parallels from the information gained in the Patrick case to the Gary McKinnon revelations. We then briefly talk about the Gary McKinnon case as well.

Next, we discuss Timothy's integral role in the MJ-12 'documents' story and get his opinion on the veracity of the documents and what he thinks was really going on in the mid-1980's when he was given that information. We then discuss who might be at the top of the UFO information pyramid in contemporary times and Timothy shares some surprising names and some expected ones. We then discuss Ufology's public relations problem and, if Timothy had his druthers, where he would like to see Ufology go in the future. This segues into some discussion on how the National Enquirer used to do some great reporting on UFOs, which is ironic given that it has such a terrible reputation. We also get Timothy's take on the 'Obama mania' that is sweeping some circles in Ufology.

We also talk about the media coverage of the UFO phenomenon and how it has seemingly started to improve in the last few years. Timothy also makes a stunning and hilarious revelation about some of the much-ballyhooed UFO files being released by the UK government. Timothy also highlights the positive side of these file dumps, even if the Ufology community isn't getting much of substance from it. Timothy also discusses another element from Need to Know: the ten year study of UFOs by the Soviet military.

Getting back to our discussion on 'gradual' disclosure, we talk about how it may be a generational movement and Timothy shares a story that encapsulates that idea. This segues into some discussion on the religious institutions and how they probably feel about the ET situation and we talk about the Vatican's announcement that it is 'okay' to believe in aliens. We also get Timothy to speculate on where Ufology may be in the next few decades and reflect on how the field seems to have gone off the rails in the last 30 years.

Heading towards the close, we find out what Timothy may be working on for future projects. Right before the close, we also go down a brief side road and talk about Timothy's other work as a professional musician and he talks about recording with Paul McCartney.

BIOGRAPHY

Worldwide research, interviewing key witnesses and discussing the subject with astronauts, military and intelligence specialists, pilots, politicians and scientists, has established Timothy Good as a leading authority on UFOs and the alien presence - the most highly classified subject on Earth.

He became interested in the subject in 1955, when his passion for aviation and space led him to read a book by Major Donald Keyhoe describing UFO sightings by qualified observers such as military and civilian pilots. In 1961, after reading a book by Captain Edward Ruppelt, a U.S. Air Force intelligence officer, he began to conduct his own research. Since then, he has amassed a wealth of evidence, including several thousand declassified intelligence documents.

Timothy Good has lectured at universities, schools, and at many organizations, including the Institute of Medical Laboratory Sciences, the Royal Canadian Military Institute, the Royal Geographical Society, the Royal Naval Air Reserve Branch, the House of Lords All-Party UFO Study Group, and the Oxford and Cambridge Union societies. In January 1989, following the dissolution of the Soviet empire, he became the first UFO researcher from the West to be interviewed on Russian television. He was invited for discussions at the Pentagon in 1998, and at the headquarters of the French Air Force in 2002. He has also acted as consultant for several U.S. Congress investigations. He is known to millions through his numerous television appearances and has co-produced several documentaries on the subject.

Timothy Good's first book, Above Top Secret: The Worldwide UFO Cover-up (1987) became an instant bestseller, and is regarded widely as the definitive work on the subject, together with the fully revised and updated book replacing it, Beyond Top Secret: The Worldwide UFO Security Threat (1996), which remained for five weeks on the Sunday Times bestseller list. Alien Liaison: The Ultimate Secret (1991) spent thirteen weeks on the same bestseller list. Alien Base: Earth's Encounters with Extraterrestrials (1998) went to No.4 on the Guardian bestseller list. His book, Unearthly Disclosure: Conflicting Interests in the Control of Extraterrestrial Intelligence (2000) was serialized in the Daily Mail. He has also edited a number of books on the subject, including the bestselling Alien Update (1993). Four of these books have a foreword by Admiral of the Fleet The Lord Hill-Norton, former Chief of the Defence Staff and Chairman of the NATO Military Committee. His latest book is Need to Know: UFOs, the Military and Intelligence, now published in paperback in the U.K. (July 2007) and in the U.S. and Canada (September 2007).

Born in London, Timothy Good completed his formal education at The King's School, Canterbury. As a violinist he gained a scholarship to the Royal Academy of Music, where he won prizes for solo, chamber and orchestral playing. His professional career began in 1963 with the Royal Philharmonic Orchestra. He played for fourteen years with the London Symphony Orchestra, and has freelanced with the English Chamber Orchestra, London Philharmonic Orchestra, Mantovani Orchestra and Philharmonia Orchestra, among others. Composers he has played for include Leonard Bernstein, Benjamin Britten, Igor Stravinsky and William Walton. He has also freelanced as a session player for television dramas, commercials, feature films, and recordings with pop musicians. Among those he has recorded for are Phil Collins, Depeche Mode, George Harrison, Elton John, Paul McCartney, Rod Stewart, and U2.

Timothy Good.mp3

SEASON 4

3.2.09
415
Ann Druffel
(1 hr 25 min.)

Topics discussed:

• In-depth discussion on Firestorm: Dr. James E. McDonald's Fight for UFO Science
• James McDonald's goals for a national UFO monitoring system
• The unspoken pressure on McDonald to provide a UFO "breakthrough"
• The Condon Report
• The "Low memo" and how McDonald was responsible for that document getting widely released
• The reaction of Ufology to the Condon Report
• If Ann thinks the UFO field was permanently damaged by the series of events that befell it in the late '60s/early '70's
• The folding of NICAP
• The events that led up to McDonald's death
• His clandestine meeting with "top government officials"
• The SST Congressional hearings which saw McDonald publicly ridiculed by a Congressman
• Family issues that plagued McDonald towards the end of his life
• His subsequent suicide and Ann's thoughts on what may have been behind it
• The result of McDonald's mysterious death on other scientists who may have been interested in UFOs
• Plus, much more in this comprehensive interview

We begin by discussing one of McDonald's goals during his tenure studying UFOs: development of a national UFO monitoring system. We speculate on why such a system has yet to be put into place by the UFO research community. We also talk about whether or not McDonald ever expressed frustration or pressure over being perceived as a leader in Ufology and the unspoken hope of many in the field that he would provide some sort of UFO breakthrough. Following that, we find out about J. Allen Hynek's reaction, in his later years, to revelations about Project Blue Book and how other government agencies had also been investigating UFOs at the time.

Covering another huge event in UFO history, we look the Condon Report from a number of angles, starting with Ann giving us some perspective on what the mood was like in Ufology as the Report was looming on the horizon. She gives some amazingly detailed background into the infamous "Low memo" which tipped Ufology off to the fact that the Condon Report would be largely negative. She also points out the huge contribution of Jim McDonald in getting the Low memo out to the public and making people aware of what was really going on within the Condon Committee. We also find out what the reaction was like, from those within Ufology, when the Condon Report was finally issued.

Ann gives us her first hand perspective of the effect of the Condon Report on UFO studies at the time. We use that discussion to segue into talking about how Ufology has changed since the difficult stretch of years that saw the Condon Report, the closure of Blue Book, NICAP folding, and McDonald's death and discuss if the field was irreperably damaged by those events. This leads to some talk of the "abduction boom" which began in 1973 and changed the course of UFO studies heading into the future. Ann makes a startling contention about what the abduction phenomenon did to the world of UFO studies and speculates on whether or not McDonald would have gotten into abduction research, had he lived to see the "swarm" of abduction reports that began shortly after he died.

We then look at yet another key event in Ufological history: the folding of NICAP. We first find out from Ann what the on-the-ground reaction was to the unseating of Keyhoe as head of NICAP. Ann relates how extensive the discussion was regarding government infiltration of NICAP at the time, recounts McDonald's reaction to the NICAP shake-up and speculates on his feelings about the turmoil in the organization.

Looking at the series of events that preceded McDonald's death, we start with his clandestine meeting with "top government officials," and Ann recounts this mysterious event and speculates about what it had been about. We then talk about the Congressional Hearings on supersonic jets that McDonald was a part of, where he was viciously attacked by a Congressman for his UFO research. Ann also reflects of the grief and sadness that befell Ufology following McDonald's death.

Wrapping up our discussion on Jim McDonald's life, we talk about his suicide in 1971 and Ann relates some of the factors that converged and left him in a state of deep depression. She also speculates on whether or not there were any nefarious factors at work with McDonald's depression. We discuss if there was any lingering fear after McDonald's death, either in Ufology or in mainstream science circles that might have had interest in UFOs.

Looking at a few big picture themes from the book, we cover McDonald's internal debate re: UFOs and the government, in that he wondered if it was a "foul up" or a "cover-up" on the part of the government. We also get Ann's take on the idea that perhaps the government actually knows very little about UFOs but is projecting greater knowledge.

We then get Ann's opinion on the evolution of Ufology in the nearly four decades since McDonald's death. She provides some amazing perspective on the "abduction boom" of the 1970's and offers her opinion on why that was, in the long run, bad for Ufology. We find out where Ann thinks the field needs to go from here. We discuss Ufology's public relations problem and also find out if Ann ever gets frustrated or worried because she's been in the field for over 50 years, seen many colleagues pass on, and yet still there have been no tangible answers to the UFO enigma.

Closing out this landmark BoA:Audio interview, we find out what Ann's working on now and what we can expect from her in the future.

BIOGRAPHY

UFO researcher and author Ann Druffel dates her interest in the UFO question from 1945 when, as a schoolgirl, she viewed a bright yellowish object, very high in clear blue skies over Long Beach, California.

Interested in earth mysteries of all kinds, Druffel has researched various aspects of the UFO question and investigated reports of all kinds since 1957. She was one of the first investigators for NICAP, remaining with that organization from April 1957 to 1973. During the NICAP years she became acquainted with the renowned atmospheric physicist, Dr. James E. McDonald, and participated with him in several UFO cases during his six years of UFO research. After NICAP was destroyed by subversive agents from the FBI and CIA who had secretly penetrated into the higher realms of NICAP, Druffel joined the Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) with which she is still actively associated as investigator, frequent contributor to their journals and other official capacities.

She was a U. S. consultant and regular contributor for the British research journal FLYING SAUCER REVIEW (FSR) through 2004. She has authored six books and numerous articles for newsstand magazines on UFOs and other earth mysteries and has contributed 190+ articles and columns for top UFO journals in the field.

Her website is www.anndruffel.com.

Ann Druffel, Part 3.mp3

SEASON 4

2.22.09
414
Ann Druffel
(1 hr 29 min.)

Topics discussed:

• In-depth discussion on Firestorm: Dr. James E. McDonald's Fight for UFO Science
• The remarkable life and amazing contributions to Ufology by renowned atmospheric physicist James McDonald
• Major events in Ufology's history all of which were experienced and witnessed first-hand by Ann and then re-experienced from McDonald's perspective when she wrote Firestorm
• Priceless perspective on this era of the history of UFO studies
• How Ann ended up writing Firestorm
• Speculation on how Ufology would look today if MacDonald hadn't died in 1971
• McDonald as "leader" of Ufology in the late 1960's
• How he bridged the gap between science and civilian UFO groups
• His visit to Blue Book in 1966 and how he ripped the lid off of what was really going on there
• His relationship with J. Allen Hynek
• The lost McDonald "small notebooks" referenced throughout Firestorm
• McDonald's view of the ETH as the "least unsatisfactory hypothesis,"
• McDonald's trip to Australia and the subsequent political fallout
• His feud with Phil Klass
• The 1968 Congressional hearing on UFOs
• Jim & Coral Lorenzen and APRO
• The Heflin photos
• Plus, of course, tons more and that's just the first half of our Firestorm discussion

We start out by having Ann recount the series of events which led to her writing Firestorm, including the amazing and unprecedented access she had to James McDonald's research materials. Looking at some of the details of the book, we start at the beginning with a statement by Ann in Firestorm that if James E. McDonald had lived past 1971, the world of Ufology today would be much, much different. We have her extrapolate on that musing and she explains why McDonald was such an important figure in Ufological history. This leads to discussion on McDonald's influence in the scientific community and how he served as a rare bridge between organized science and civilian UFO investigators. Staying within the realm of Ufology history, we talk about the rarely discussed Civilian Saucer Investigation (CSI) organization, based out of NY, that was a major influence on NICAP.

Looking at McDonald's evolution and entry into the field of Ufology, we start by talking about how his original plan (and hope) was to spend the Summer of 1966 studying UFOs and that his research would be enough to convince the scientific community to investigate the phenomenon. Next we talk about McDonald's visits to Project Blue Book in 1966 and his enraged reaction to how the organization was handling UFO reports. This leads to us talking about the first, of many, moments in McDonald's brief UFO research career where he directly influenced the field: acting as a major whistleblower to the unscientific UFO research going on at Blue Book.

This segues into the infamous meeting between McDonald and J. Allen Hynek, which occurred the day after McDonald's visit to Blue Book. Ann discusses the difference of opinion between Hynek and McDonald with regards to the political implications of the UFO phenomenon and why Hynek had a much different approach to the UFO issue, due to his status (and income) as Blue Book's scientific consultant. We also look at Hynek's contributions to the UFO field and why he should not be vilified by the community for his close association with the government.

We look at one of the continuing enigmas of Firestorm, McDonald's "small notebooks" of confidential UFO information, which are referenced in his journals but have yet to be discovered. Ann gives detailed background on this enigma and speculates on what became of them. She also updates us on any progress made towards finding the still-missing "small notebooks" and details her use of "psychic archaeology" to help determine their location.

Then we cover an over-arching theme of the book: James McDonald as Ufology's unspoken leader and we reflect on the UFO field's lack of a leader like McDonald in the years following his death. We then examine McDonald's famous description of the ETH as the "least unsatisfactory hypothesis" and Ann sheds more light on what McDonald meant by this. She also talks about how the radio-visual UFO cases that McDonald uncovered were essential to his theories on UFOs. We reflect on McDonald's first public presentation on UFOs and how he included, and subsequently dropped from all future presentations, an additional hypothesis for UFOs that involved psychic phenomena.

Moving along chronologically in McDonald's life, we then discuss his trip to Australia and the amazing amount of UFO investigation he did down there during a very short visit. Ann points out the unique aspect of McDonald's investigation of the UFO cases in Australia and how the infamous Fr.Gill case made a lasting impression on him. We then talk about how the press coverage in Australia ended up setting the stage for a myriad of problems for McDonald when he returned to America. This leads to some discussion on Phil Klass and his vendetta against McDonald. Ann recounts her personal interraction with Klass and shares her thoughts on what Klass' true motivations for UFO debunking may have been.

We then examine another big event in Ufological history that McDonald was intricately involved with: the 1968 Congressional Hearing on UFOs. Ann speculates on why there was no follow up to the 1968 UFO hearing and gives her take on Jacques Vallee's perspective on the hearing: that it was more of a PR effort rather than a true investigation into UFOs. Looking at the Congressional hearing from a big picture perspective, we find out from Ann what the mood was like in Ufology when Congress finally decided to investigate UFOs.

This line of discussion segues into talk of APRO and the Lorenzens and Ann recounts her interraction with the group during the 1960's. She talks about the philosophical differences between APRO and NICAP regarding humanoid cases and reflects on whether or not that difference of opinion extended throughout Ufology at the time. She also shares details of Jim McDonald's limited interractions with APRO and explains why he was not more involved with the organization.

We then look at another big section of Firestorm, the Heflin photo case, specifically the strange circumstances surrounding the disappearance of the photos and their return 30 years later. Ann speculates on why the stolen photos may have been returned, comments on their condition upon their resurfacing, and reveals where they are today. She also talks about the contemporary studies of the Heflin photos, now that the originals are available.

BIOGRAPHY

UFO researcher and author Ann Druffel dates her interest in the UFO question from 1945 when, as a schoolgirl, she viewed a bright yellowish object, very high in clear blue skies over Long Beach, California.

Interested in earth mysteries of all kinds, Druffel has researched various aspects of the UFO question and investigated reports of all kinds since 1957. She was one of the first investigators for NICAP, remaining with that organization from April 1957 to 1973. During the NICAP years she became acquainted with the renowned atmospheric physicist, Dr. James E. McDonald, and participated with him in several UFO cases during his six years of UFO research. After NICAP was destroyed by subversive agents from the FBI and CIA who had secretly penetrated into the higher realms of NICAP, Druffel joined the Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) with which she is still actively associated as investigator, frequent contributor to their journals and other official capacities.

She was a U. S. consultant and regular contributor for the British research journal FLYING SAUCER REVIEW (FSR) through 2004. She has authored six books and numerous articles for newsstand magazines on UFOs and other earth mysteries and has contributed 190+ articles and columns for top UFO journals in the field.

Her website is www.anndruffel.com.

Ann Druffel, Part 2.mp3

SEASON 4

2.15.09
413
Ann Druffel
(1 hr 36 min.)

Topics discussed:

• The Tujunga Canyon Contacts from a number of angles
• This recently re-issued book, which Ann co-wrote with D. Scott Rogo, was only the second alien abduction book ever written, when it was originally released in 1980
• How she got involved in the case
• How the world of Ufology and abductions met in the 1970's
• The "contagen" effect of the abductions discussed in the book
• Ann's unique and groundbreaking theory on abductions and how she applies other aspects of the phenomenon to her hypothesis
• Details of the book including how she felt about one of the abductee's inability to break through memory blocks
• The alleged "cancer cure" given to one of the abductees by the "aliens," and tons more
• Two key figures in Ann's life
• His relationship with J. Allen Hynek
• The lost McDonald "small notebooks" referenced throughout Firestorm
• McDonald's view of the ETH as the "least unsatisfactory hypothesis,"
• McDonald's trip to Australia and the subsequent political fallout
• His feud with Phil Klass
• The 1968 Congressional hearing on UFOs
• Jim & Coral Lorenzen and APRO
• The Heflin photos
• Plus, of course, tons more and that's just the first half of our Firestorm discussion

We kick things off with some bio/background on Ann Druffel. She begins by detailing her childhood UFO sighting, in 1945, which was the impetus for her interest in the phenomenon. This leads to Ann recounting how her active career in UFO research began in 1957, when she joined the then-newly formed NICAP organization.

We then dive into discussion on The Tujunga Canyon Contacts and Ann begins by explaining how the tenor of Ufology had begun to undergo a radical sea change of reports in 1973. She then gives us a thumbnail look at how she ended up investigating the Tujunga stories, the evolution of the published work on the unique abduction case, and how this all led to her subsequent book How to Defend Yourself Against Alien Abduction. We then find out about how there was a stark contrast in the reaction of the UFO community to the two different books.

This segues into Ann putting forth her theory on what abductions truly are and how they may have nothing to do with UFOs. Returning the discussion on the Tujunga cases, we talk about the "contagen" effect that seemed to be at work with these cases, something which the authors' point out had never, up to that point, been reported before, and find out if, since the publication of the book, more cases of "contageous" abductions have occurred.

Looking at a specific element to the book, we talk about one of the abductees, Jan Whitley, and the repeated attempts to unlock her blocked memories via hypnosis, all of which failed, and we find out Ann's reaction, as a researcher, to this sort of obstacle. This leads to Ann discussing one big problem with contemporary abduction research done via hypnosis. That observation segues into us getting Ann's opinion on whether abduction research via hypnosis has progressed or regressed in the last 30 years since Tujunga was published. From there we talk about how, much like with UFOs in general, the ETH has become synonymous with abductions, despite little actual proof that ETs are perpetrating the events.

Up next we discuss what Ann calls the "Tujunga Canyon UFO Milleau" which is the observation that that part of California is a hot spot for not just UFO activity but an assortment of esoteric anomalies. This segues into an observation made at the close of the book, that perhaps abductions befall people in atypical living situations and lifestyles because that is what may interest the intelligence behind the abductions and we ponder if this theory has been borne out over the last three decades since the book was published. We then look another interesting sidestory within the Tujunga Canyon Contacts and that is an alleged "cancer cure" purportedly given to one of the abductees by the ETs.

Since the original re-issue of Tujunga was in 1988, we find out from Ann if there have been any developments in the case since then and she details how it laid the groundwork for her subsequent book How To Defend Yourself Against Alien Abductions. She talks about how, in recent years, there has been a renaissance and re-examination of her work with "resisters" by the abduction community.

Delving some more into Ann's alternative theory to abductions, we get her take on how many reported abductions are really done at the hands of ETs or "aliens." She also explains her hypothesis that "alien abductions" are just the American-ized version of long-told stories of ancient encounters with interdimensional entities. We also find out where Ann sees actual UFOs fitting into her abduction theory.

Looking at one specific incident from the Tegunja Canyon Contacts, we talk about the "reststop encounter" of Jan, Emily, and Emily's young son and find out if the youngster ever had any abduction experiences later on in his life. This segues into discussion of Ann's abduction theory and if she has looked at or applied the "generational" hypothesis, popular in abduction research, to her theory. We also find out how Ann reconciles the "alien implant" aspect of abduction research with her theories on abductions.

Looking at some of the key players who influenced Ann's career and the Tujunga book, Ann talks about former California NICAP director Idabel Epperson, whom she calls a "mentor" in the book. Ann recalls the NICAP LA meetings which were held in Idabel's home and what the atmosphere there was like when researchers like J. Allen Hynek and James McDonald were in town and visited the group. She recounts in fascinating detail how she ended up being a part of the LA NICAP group, what is was like being a woman in the field during those early days, and how Idabel Epperson shaped her research. Ann also teases that she is working on her memoirs, which will surely shed new light on early Ufological history. She also talks about the transition of the LA group from NICAP to MUFON in 1971.

Wrapping up our discussion on the Tujunga Canyon Contacts, we discuss Ann's co-author on the book, the late D. Scott Rogo. We first talk about his shocking murder in 1990 and the amazing story of how psychic information led to the capture of one of his murderers. Ann then talks about her experience working with Rogo on the Tujunga book. And, closing out this portion of the interview, we find out where folks can pick up a copy of this remarkable and historic abduction book.

BIOGRAPHY

UFO researcher and author Ann Druffel dates her interest in the UFO question from 1945 when, as a schoolgirl, she viewed a bright yellowish object, very high in clear blue skies over Long Beach, California.

Interested in earth mysteries of all kinds, Druffel has researched various aspects of the UFO question and investigated reports of all kinds since 1957. She was one of the first investigators for NICAP, remaining with that organization from April 1957 to 1973. During the NICAP years she became acquainted with the renowned atmospheric physicist, Dr. James E. McDonald, and participated with him in several UFO cases during his six years of UFO research. After NICAP was destroyed by subversive agents from the FBI and CIA who had secretly penetrated into the higher realms of NICAP, Druffel joined the Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) with which she is still actively associated as investigator, frequent contributor to their journals and other official capacities.

She was a U. S. consultant and regular contributor for the British research journal FLYING SAUCER REVIEW (FSR) through 2004. She has authored six books and numerous articles for newsstand magazines on UFOs and other earth mysteries and has contributed 190+ articles and columns for top UFO journals in the field.

Her website is www.anndruffel.com.

Ann Druffel, Part 1.mp3

SEASON 4

11.23.08
405
George Knapp
(1 hr 24 min.)

Topics discussed:

• The evolution of George's journalism career
• His investigation into Area 51 and the subsequent fall-out in Ufology
• His take on UFO studies
• Reflections on his research into the Skinwalker Ranch
• The latest news on his coverage of the Needles UFO case from earlier this Summer

We kick things off with a little bit of background on George Knapp and his evolution as a TV reporter. We dive right into the UFO discussion by first talking about George's investigation into Area 51. He begins by telling us about the background to his research into Area 51, including the influence of esoteric players like John Lear, Bill Cooper, and Bob Lazar in helping to fuel George's discovery of the infamous esoteric landmark and the subsequent explosion of Area 51 as a paranormal meme.

This leads to us hearing some remarkable stories about the reaction to George's Area 51 work from his colleagues in the news media. We get George's fascinating insider perspective on the long-standing belief, in some Ufological circles, of a media coverup of the UFO subject. We also get his take on the apparent changes in the media in the last year with regards to UFOs and how the coverage seems to be getting more positive. He also talks about some of his dealings with the basic cable UFO shows and his disappointment with how some of them are put together.

Next we talk about George's initial introduction to the world of Ufology, including attending the infamous 1989 MUFON convention which saw Bill Moore reveal his government connections and John Lear stage a mutiny and attempt to form his own convention within the convention. He also talks about the fallout from his reports on Area 51 and how various camps in Ufology used the story to their own ends. This leads to a general discussion on some of the problems of UFO studies today.

Looking at the future of Ufology, we ask George if there's any way to "save" Ufology or if it has degenerated too far beyond the point of saving. He tells us about how organizations like NIDS might be the ideal scenario for serious investigation of the UFO phenomenon. This segues into a discussion on the "economy of Ufology" and how the problems of the field take their toll on the good researchers who need funds to continue their work.

Moving on, we get George's opinion, based on his research, on how much the government really knows about UFOs. He reveals what aspect of the UFO phenomenon and the potential government coverup has always interested him the most. We also get his take on the idea of a "global conspiracy" to keep the UFO subject secret by certain countries. We then find out why George does not foresee UFO disclosure by the government at any point in the future and what it probably would take to blow the lid off the UFO secret.

We also get his thoughts on the Exopolitics movement that has sprung up in the last decade. He details some of the political problems with dealing with UFOs and shares an amazing story of a 2000 Congressional hearing on UFOs that almost happened but was thwarted by the very people pushing for UFO disclosure. Staying on the topic of UFO disclosure, George tells us about some of the potential political stumbling blocks that would likely prevent such a release of UFO information. He also shares his opinion that if UFO disclosure happened, then there might be some kind of criminal charges filed against some of the people who have kept the "truth" hidden from the public. He also makes the Devil's Argument that perhaps the truth behind UFOs is "too much" for the public to bear.

Up next, we cover George's groundbreaking work covering the Skinwalker Ranch (about which he co-wrote Hunt for the Skinwalker with Colm Kelleher). We start by finding out why the story seems to still resonate so much with people, nearly three years after the book was written. We then talk about George's experience investigating the infamous ranch and he tells us about how the book came about in the first place. He talks about one story from the ranch that they debated including in the book, because it was almost "too outrageous," but they decided to include it after all. He also shares some great stories about his personal experiences visiting the ranch.

We then discuss some of George's most recent work in the UFO realm: his investigation into a reported UFO crash in Needles, California. He gives a detailed look at the story, including the "post-crash" fallout of the story. He recounts some of the reports of Men In Black in the area after the event and his remarkable run-in with government agents and gives his frank assessment of what happened during that incident.

Heading towards the close, we get George's perspective on hosting Coast to Coast AM twice a month. He also tells us what guest he'd like to have on the show and hasn't had the chance to interview yet. We also find out what's next for George Knapp in the esoteric field.

BIOGRAPHY

George Knapp was born in Woodbury, N.J., and raised mostly in Northern California. He graduated from high school in Stockton, Calif.; earned a bachelor's degree in communications from West Georgia College; and later earned a master's degree in communications from the University of the Pacific, where he also taught speech and debate and served as director of forensics. George also taught speech at California Polytechnic University, coached the debate team at the University of California at Berkeley and taught broadcast journalism at UNLV.

Along the way, George also worked as a hodcarrier, farm laborer, carpenter's assistant and house painter. He moved to Las Vegas in 1979 and landed a job as a taxi driver. Later, he worked at KLVX-TV Channel 10 as a part-time studio cameraman and production assistant. KLAS-TV hired him in 1981 as a general assignment reporter. George also has co-anchored various newscasts for Eyewitness News.

He has earned two regional Edward R. Murrow awards and a national Edward R. Murrow award for his investigative stories on the voter registration fraud. Nine times, he has won the Mark Twain Award for best news writing from the Associated Press. And in 1990, his series about UFOs was selected by United Press International as best in the nation for Individual Achievement by a Journalist. In addition to that, he has won 14 Emmy Awards.

He is also the co-author of Hunt for the Skinwalker and hosts Coast to Coast AM every 3rd & 4th Sunday of the month.

SEASON 3

7.20.08
331
Linda Moulton Howe
(1 Hr 8 Min.)

Topics discussed:

• Her history in broadcasting
• the phenomena of cattle mutilation
• Linda's infamous meeting with Richard Doty
• The Lonnie Zamora UFO incident
• Linda's take on being a woman in the field of ufology
• Where she sees the UFO phenomenon going in the near future
• why proving UFOs are real is no longer relevant
• use of scientific equipment on UFO investigations
• the six social effects caused by belief in UFOs
• Information she received regarding government policy towards UFOs

We kick things off with Linda recounting her history in broadcasting, including her time at Stanford University and TV stations in Boston and Denver. This leads to her telling the story of her serendipitous introduction to the cattle mutilation phenomena. From there, she talks about her film A Strange Harvest and why she found the cat mut story so compelling. She also shares the surprising reaction by the station's general manager to A Strange Harvest. This leads to the recounting of her full-time entrance into the field of reporting on high strangeness.

Next, we find out what drives Linda to keep researching earth mysteries after all these years. We find out if she ever regrets deciding to research the paranormal, given that her career in mainstream reporting was flourishing prior to that.

Following that, Linda gives us a detailed recounting of her infamous meeting with Richard Doty in 1983. She explains how the Doty meeting came about in the first place, on a matter of happenstance. From there, she gives us an amazingly detailed account of the meeting with Doty, including a number of bizarre elements and the purported revelations about ETs and UFOs that were imparted to her.

Based on what we know about Doty now and her own research, Linda speculates on how much of the information she was given was accurate and how much was disinformation. We find out if she has had any contact with Doty since that fateful meeting in 1983 and she details what her research has uncovered with regards to the Lonnie Zamora UFO incident at Socorro, New Mexico.

She goes on to explain how the Doty meeting, and his unfullfilled promises, led to the derailing of her HBO project on the UFO phenomenon. This includes some remarkable perspective on the response of HBO to the information she'd gotten from Doty and the requirements that the channel placed on Linda if she was to proceed with the special. This leads to her explaining why her book was titled An Alien Harvest, coming ten years after her critically acclaimed film had been titled A Strange Harvest.

Looking at a big picture issue, we get Linda's take on being a woman in the field of Ufology and high strangeness. She talks about how her upbringing may have paved the way for her to be unafraid of entering male dominated fields. She also shares a truly amazing story of sexism she encountered in the TV industry after she left Stanford.

Wrapping things up, we find out where Linda sees the UFO phenomenon going in the near and distant future. We also get her perspective on the Exopolitics movement and UFO disclosure activism. She shares information that she has received with regards to a government policy on UFO disclosure.

BIOGRAPHY

Linda Moulton Howe is a graduate of Stanford University with a Masters Degree in Communication. She has devoted her documentary film, television, radio, writing and reporting career to productions concerning science, medicine and the environment. Ms. Howe has received local, national and international awards, including three regional Emmys, a national Emmy nomination and a Station Peabody award for medical programming. Linda’s documentaries have included A Strange Harvest and Strange Harvests 1993, which explored the worldwide animal mutilation mystery. Another film, A Prairie Dawn, focused on astronaut training in Denver. She has also produced documentaries in Ethiopia and Mexico for UNICEF about child survival efforts and for Turner Broadcasting in Atlanta about environmental challenges.

In addition to television, Linda produces, reports and edits the award-winning science, environment and earth mysteries news website, Earthfiles.com. In 2003, Earthfiles received an Award for Standard of Excellence presented by the internet’s WebAward Association. Earthfiles also received the 2001 Encyclopaedia Britannica Award for Journalistic Excellence. Linda also reports science, environment and earth mysteries news for Clear Channel’s Premiere Radio Networks and Unknowncountry.com. In 2005, she traveled to Amsterdam, Hawaii, and several other U. S. conferences to speak about her investigative journalism.

In 2004, Linda was on-camera TV reporter for The History Channel’s documentary investigation of an unusual August 2004 cow death in Farnam, Nebraska. Linda also traveled to Florence and San Marino, Italy, to speak about her earth mysteries investigations. She also produced and reported Earthfiles segments for Comcast Cable broadcasts in San Francisco and Los Angeles.

Her website is earthfiles.com.

SEASON 3

5.25.08
325
Bill Chalker
(1 Hr 25 Min.)

Topics discussed:

• We cover the history of Australian UFO studies from both a civilian and government perspective
• The fascinating story of Edgar Jarrold
• Bill's examination of the official Australian UFO files
• The media's coverage of the UFO phenomenon in Australia
• How the general public feels about Unidentified Flying Objects in the land Down Under
• The world of Chinese Ufology
• All that and, of course, tons and tons more

We begin the second half by examining another aspect of Australian Ufology: the history of organized UFO studies Down Under, including the fascinating story of Edgar Jarrold, the "father of Australian Ufology." Looking at the situation in America, where serious minded scientists at first supported UFO studies and then, following the Condon Report, backed away, we find out how closely that situation was mirrored in Australia. This leads to Bill telling us about how he was granted direct access to the Australian UFO files in 1982 and discovered nuclear physicist Harry Turner, who played a pivotal role in clandestine military investigations into UFOs. Bill shares a stunning story of how friction between US Air Force officials and Donald Keyhoe resulted in the derailing of the first official Australian investigation into UFOs during the mid-1950's.

Bill also shares the remarkable story of how Harry Turner almost put together a "rapid intervention team" of military types to investigate UFO sightings and landings in Australia. He also reveals the shocking turn of events that stymied the RIT project, which surrounded the fallout of the Condon Report, that was felt all the way in Australia. We also find out how extensively the government investigated UFOs in the decades after that. Bill talks about an intriguing case, that he uncovered in the official UFO files, from 1973 in Western Australia, which co-incided with a nuclear alert and raised tensions between the US and Russia.

Jumping back to organized UFO studies, we get Bill's opinion on the state of Ufology in Australia today. Bill explains how the situation has changed, as far as organized UFO groups, in Australia since the inception of Ufology there in the 1950's and '60's. He talks about attempts to create a national network of UFO groups in Australia and some of the roadblocks that arose that made such an enterprise difficult.

Looking again at the government's role in investigating UFOs, we find out if there has even been an Australian version of Project Blue Book or an MOD defense desk job similar to the one formerly held in the UK by Nick Pope. Bill compares official Australian UFO investigations with civilian investigations and explains why the civilian ones seem to have more credibility. We get Bill's thoughts on the possibility of a UFO cover-up permeating the Australian government. This segues into some discussion on the Westall School case of 1966 and why Bill thinks it is a good example of potential government cover-up. Wrapping up the government / military discussion, we find out if there is much deference by the Australian officials to the US or UK governments, with regards to UFO issues. On this topic, Bill tells us about the 1953 Drury Film which was sent to America for analysis and returned with large portions of the film deleted.

Getting a little bit wild, we find out what Bill knows about the longstanding rumours of an alien base at Mt. Zeil and/or the Pine Gap facility in Australia.

Following that, we look at the next big pillar of influence on Ufology in Australia: the media. Bill tells us about how the media coverage of the UFO phenomenon has changed over the years in Australia. Bill details his observation that there is a "dumbing down" process at work and not engaging the substantial nature of the phenomenon. He talks about some of his experiences working with the media in Australia. We then find out how extensive the paranormal media is in Australia as compared to in the US.

Tackling the last puzzle piece in the big picture of Australian Ufology, we discuss the perspective of the everyday public with regards to the UFO phenomenon. Bill details some interesting poll numbers that have surfaced in Australia with regards to belief in UFOs. Scraping the bottom of the proverbial barrel, we discuss UFO skeptics, creatures that sadly exist in Australia as well.

Going off in a whole 'nother direction, we discuss the world of Chinese Ufology, which Bill has investigated. He gives some great insight into how the world of civilian Ufology had developed in China since the 1970's. He reveals the remarkable popularity with which the subject has been embraced in the country. We discuss the difficulties of the language barrier between these two worlds, as most of the key Chinese Ufologists don't speak English. Given the perceived tyrannical nature of the Chinese government, we find out how they feel about the civilian UFO research groups that have sprung up in that country. Bill reveals what he has learned about official government investigations into UFOs in China including a bizarre story of an alleged alien infestation in one small town.

Wrapping things up, we find out what's next for Bill Chalker in the near and distant future.

BIOGRAPHY

Bill Chalker is one of Australia's leading UFO researchers and has written extensively on the subject. He is a contributing editor for the International UFO Reporter and coordinates the NSW UFO INVESTIGATION CENTRE (UFOIC). He was the Australian representative for the Aerial Phenomena Research Organisation (APRO) from 1978 to 1986 and NSW state representative for the Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) from 1976 to 1993.

In 1996, Bill Chalker's book on the Australia UFO experience, "The OZ Files: the Australian UFO story", was published in Australia by Duffy & Snellgrove. 2005 saw the publication of his second book "Hair of the Alien" which details his forensic investigation into the Peter Khoury abduction case.

His websites are www.theozfiles.com and ozfiles.blogspot.com

Bill Chalker, Part 2.mp3

SEASON 3

5.18.08
324
Bill Chalker
(1 Hr 15 Min.)

Topics discussed:

• The history of the UFO phenomenon in Australia
• Aboriginal times to key pre-1947 cases to noteworthy sightings and the UFO boom of the 1950's
• The explosion in abduction research of the 1990's and onward
• Key cases like the 1954 "Sea Fury Incident"
• The Father Gill case
• The Mundrabilla case of 1988
• His forensic investigation into an alleged abduction that spawned the book "Hair of the Alien"

We kick things off with the usual bio/background on Bill Chalker and find out how he got interested in the UFO phenomenon. We begin our investigation of Australian Ufology by first finding out about the history of the phenomenon Down Under. He tells us about a key case from 1868 in Australia which resembled a contactee-type event and another key case from 1927 which resembled "an early version of the Mothman prophecy." We also talk about some of the Aboriginal history related to UFOs.

We compare and contrast the evolution of the UFO phenomenon in Australia with its American counterpart. This includes some fascinating perspective on how the UFO subject was viewed by the Australian media and public during the early years of the "modern UFO era." Bill tells us about the first big national UFO flap in Victoria, Australia in 1954. We find out if there has been any change in description of UFOs, as has seemed to be the case here in America.

Next, Bill talks about one of the key cases in Australian UFO history, starting with a detailed recounting of a 1954 sighting by a Royal Australian Navy pilot, which drew national attention in Australia and was studied by famous US Ufologists Dr. Jim McDonald and J.Allen Hynek. We find out about the uniqueness of UFO waves in Australia, which Bill says "have a pretty distinct pattern." Bill tells us about the "Father Gill case" from 1959 in Papua New Guinea, then an Australian colony. Bill recounts the 1978 Valentich case, which saw a pilot disappear after a UFO encounter, a story which gained global prominence in UFO circles.

We also find out about the Mundrabilla case of 1988, another UFO encounter that gained worldwide prominence. Bill explains how this case changed the tenor of UFO reports in Australia and served as a cautionary tale for UFO witnesses in the country. Looking at the 1990's, Bill tells us about how the abduction phenomenon took the country by storm and pushed UFO reports to the wayside. We then find out about the two most prominent abduction cases in Australia, starting with the Kelly Cahill case. Bill shares a decision he made, with regards to the case, that he later says he grew to regret.

The other key abduction case discussed is Peter Khoury's abduction experience. Bill recounts Khoury's initial confusion over the abduction and the revelation of what had happened after seeing a billboard for the paperback release of "Communion" in Australia. This leads to Bill talking about Khoury's 1992 experience, that resulted in the recovery of physical evidence, the research of which would become the basis for Bill's book "Hair of the Alien."

BIOGRAPHY

Bill Chalker is one of Australia's leading UFO researchers and has written extensively on the subject. He is a contributing editor for the International UFO Reporter and coordinates the NSW UFO INVESTIGATION CENTRE (UFOIC). He was the Australian representative for the Aerial Phenomena Research Organisation (APRO) from 1978 to 1986 and NSW state representative for the Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) from 1976 to 1993.

In 1996, Bill Chalker's book on the Australia UFO experience, "The OZ Files: the Australian UFO story", was published in Australia by Duffy & Snellgrove. 2005 saw the publication of his second book "Hair of the Alien" which details his forensic investigation into the Peter Khoury abduction case.

His websites are www.theozfiles.com and ozfiles.blogspot.com

Bill Chalker, Part 1.mp3

SEASON 3

5.4.08
322
Carl Feindt
(1 Hr 24 Min.)

Topics discussed:

• Why Carl decided to investigate the ufo-water connection
• Interesting trends and fascinating insights that he has gained from his research
• Cases that he does not think are related to UFOs
• The international aspects of the phenomenon
• Sea monsters
• Radar and sonar cases
• UFOs. v. USOs
• "Water Wheels"
• The Eltanin
• Shag Harbour
• and a ton more aquatic-themed esoteric material

We kick things off with the standard bio / background on Carl Feindt, how he got interested in the UFO phenomenon, specifically the water-UFO connection. We then discuss why it seems like USOs have remained in the background of UFO studies. After that, we talk about Carl's exhaustive website waterufo.net and how he collected the vast number of cases detailed at the site. This segues into some discussion on how the work of Ted Phillips inspired Carl to investigate USOs.

We look at some of the USO trends that have emerged as Carl has compiled so many cases. Looking at perhaps the key trend that Carl has discovered, we discuss the UFO's physical effects on water, a revelation that Carl says made him a true believer in the UFO phenomenon. He gives a detailed summation of the four types of UFO and water interraction and how they explain a lot about the way UFOs operate. We talk about potential "trace cases" upon the water. This leads to some discussion on the water temperature changes caused by UFOs.

Carl destroys binnall's theory of USOs and aircraft carriers, which leads to talk about sonar and radar reports of USOs. After that, we find out about Carl's cases that involve "death in the water" and why he stresses to future Ufologists to "have the specimens analyzed." We cover fish reactions to USOs. Carl shares the influences on his "field theory" regarding UFOs and what the mystery of the field was to him.

We talk about a fascinating case of two divers who died possibly due to exposure to a USO and how heat generated from the UFO's field has been reported to cause rain to turn into steam. Carl explains why he hates theories about UFOs taking ships and how that line of thinking is a systemic problem related to UFO studies. Staying in line with temperature effects from the UFOs, we talk about reports of interraction between the craft and ice along with snow and UFOs. We also explore the potential of snow circles, similar to crop circles.

After that, we look at the possibility that classic sea monster reports could actually be USOs. We find out if there is an average USO report, i.e. going into and out of the water, going in and not coming out, just coming out, totally submerged, etc. Carl also explains how the USO reports run the gamut of all bodies of water, except for one and he explains why.

USOs taking on water ... we get Carl's opinion on why there are some reports of USOs extracting water. We talk about "water wheels" and why Carl says they are a real phenomenon but not almost certainly not related to USOs. Staying on the topic of UFO occupants taking on water, we discuss some of the stories where this occurs. Carl explains how this is different from the appearance of UFOs floating over water and sucking it up. We also find out that these stories of occupants obtaining water for their UFOs range from the late 1800's all the way up to 2001.

Carl debunks the Eltanin, "alien antenna" story, and explains how it is actually a natural formation. He also shares some fascinating insight into the reaction from Ufology when researchers debunked the Eltanin story. This segues into a discussion on the "underwater bases" theory surrounding UFOs. We also talk about the global nature of USO reports, including Switzerland and Iraq.

We cover "abductees and water" and some of the stories that Carl has regarding tales told by abductees regarding UFO water interraction. We get his opinion on the liklihood that the USO reports in contemporary times are really government black ops projects.

Carl shares how he encouraged Keith Chester to write his book on foo fighters, which leads to discussion on old UFO cases. Looking at other categories of USO reports, we talk about UFOs beaming light into water and what the reasoning behind that might be. We also talk about the "water nest" story from Australia and how it relates to the water / UFO connection. Carl explains why he thinks "the field" has no relation to how the UFO travels, rather acting as a force field of sorts.

We find out Carl's favorite reported USO case in his collection and why Shag Harbour is not his favorite case. He talks about how he thinks the UFO at Shag Harbour was less a crash and more a repair job of a functioning craft. Looking at failed attempts by the U.S. to develop a USO-type craft, we talk about the "flying submarine" study from 1965. Returning again to trends, we find out the main location for witnesses who see UFOs interracting with water as well as the difference between nighttime and daytime UFO sightings.

Carl explains why UFOs interracting with water provide us with a unique opportunity, tha does not exist with an airborne UFO, to study the craft. Heading towards the close, we find out about instances of enforced secrecy by the Navy onto witnesses of USOs. We also find out the latest developments on Carl putting out a book on the UFO-water connection.

BIOGRAPHY

Carl Feindt has been fascinated by aviation since the late days of WWII. Starting with carved balsa replicas and later by flying models of aircraft, he followed his passion into service as a cadet in the Civil Air Patrol. After high school, he studied aircraft engineering at the Academy of Aeronautics (off LaGuardia Airport’s runway) in New York City. Following two years with the Air Force, a family hardship forced him to return to civilian life where he joined a major airline for which he worked in customer service for 34 years.

Upon retirement, he was interested in becoming active in Ufology, about which he had been reading since the early 60’s. The opportunity came when Jan Aldrich, a UFO researcher, asked for volunteers to do local newspaper searches. Over the course of eight years, he studied microfilm rolls at the University of Delaware, exhaustively covering the years between 1923 and 1967, and found approximately 750 UFO-related articles – this from the second smallest state in the union.

Intrigued by the fact that aircraft cannot emerge from or submerge into water, he started assembling water-related UFO cases which have grown into a data base of this aspect of the UFO mystery.

His website is www.waterufo.net.

Carl Feindt.mp3

SEASON 3

3.23.08
319
Gildas Bourdais
(1 Hr 24 Min.)

Topics discussed:

• We'll be talking about the French UFO scene and it's history and evolution
• Official government sponsored French UFO studies through the years
• The Cometa report
• Media coverage of UFOs
• The attitude of the everyday public with regards to UFOs
• A re-examination of percentages of unknown UFOs
• The release of French UFO files in March '07
• The state of French Ufology today
• And tons more

We kick things off with the standard bio / background on Gildas Bourdias and how he got interested in the UFO phenomenon. Following that, Gildas tells us about the history of the UFO phenomenon in France throughout the twentieth century and how it compares to the US's UFO history. We then move on to talk about his recent article detailing the history of "official" French UFO studies. We begin by looking at the birth of "official" French Ufology with the government organization GEPAN. Gildas explains how GEPAN was originally created by the military and opposed by the scientific community in France. He also details the unique situation where French Ufologists were attacking the official government UFO project, almost from the onset of the group.

Looking at the conspiracy angle to official French Ufology, Gildas gives his opinion on whether or not there are secret UFO files in France. He also explains the UFO scene in France during the 1980's, a period which Gildas says was "very complex." Jumping back to the chronology of official French Ufology, we look at the tumultuous period of the 1980's and the transition of GEPAN to a new group called SEPRA. He talks about how the Cometa report changed the face of official French Ufology, causing the closing of SEPRA and, subsquently, the creation of a third generation official French UFO group: GEIPAN. He also talks about the evolution of the Cometa report, how it started inside the government but became a private project.

Gazing back at the history of UFO events in France, Gildas tells us about how far back UFO reports go in French history and an interesting case from the 1800's. He also talks about a key wave of UFO sightings in the 1950's and talks about one of the more famous cases from that UFO wave. Closing out the discussion on official French UFO studies, we get Gildas's opinion on why France has continued with official French UFO studies while America ceased their official studies with the closing of Blue Book in the 1970's.

Gildas tells us what he has observed in other European countries with regards to official government sponsored studies of UFOs and files on UFOs held by the various European governments. He also speculates on how much the UK government may know about UFOs, compared to the French government.

Next we look at the history of civilian UFO groups in France. Gildas tells about how the field has differed from its American counterpart. He then talks about the evolution of civilian French Ufology from the 1950's to today. He talks about the two big UFO groups of the 1960's and a key French journalist who covered UFOs in the 1970's. He then explains how the momentum of that era seemed to die out as Ufology was faced with a "movement of skepticism" in the mid-1970's and the creation of the "Rationalist Union" in France. Gildas conveys the mood of the 1970's, as official French Ufology was taking off and, at the same time, being attacked by the skeptics.

Gildas discusses "nuts and bolts" versus spiritualism debate within Ufology and how pervasive that debate is within French Ufology. He also shares his opinion that the ideas of parallel worlds and dimensions may be used to confuse the UFO issue and protect UFO secrecy. This leads to some discussion on Jacques Vallee and his influence on changing the perception of what UFOs may be and Gildas gives his point of view on this changing examination of UFOs.

We then get Gildas's opinion on how French Ufology feels about its American counterpart. Is there resentment of the American UFO scene or America's perceived stranglehold on UFO information. He also goes on to talk about how his opinion has changed, over the years, regarding UFO secrecy and now thinks some secrets need to be held back from the public.

After that, we cover another big topic: the role of the French media and their stance on covering the topic of UFOs. Gildas explains how the media coverage of the UFO phenomenon has evolved over the years and why he thinks it is getting better. He gives tremendous detail on the interesting influence that the "alien autopsy" film had on the French media's coverage of UFOs. He also tells us about how some papers were vehemently against UFO coverage but have recently changed their stance and why the change seems to have come about.

Looking at the general population of France, we get Gildas's perspective on what their attitude regarding UFOs is. He gives an estimate on what percentage of people accept the reality of UFOs in France. Moving on, we get Gildas's reaction to the release of the French UFO files in March of 2007. He talks about the downside of the UFO file release and the positives which have resulted from the release of the files. He also talks about some of the cases detailed in the released files. This leads to a side discussion on the atmosphere in France, where there are considerably more pro-UFO books published, but the skeptics get more air time by the media. We get Gildas's opinion on whether or not that situation is the result of an organized cover-up.

Heading towards the end, we look at Gildas's "question of percentages", where he suggests that the percentage of true UFOs amongst UFO reports is much higher than the usually attributed 5%. Gildas explains how he came to this conclusion based on the released UFO files in France and he speculates on what the true percentage may be.

Wrapping it all up, Gildas shares his perspective on the state of French Ufology and what's coming up next for him.

BIOGRAPHY

Gildas Bourdais was born in 1939, studied Business administration, worked in technical publishing, and lives near Paris, France. He became interested in UFOs, first by reading the books of French author Aimé Michel in the 60’s, and the books of Dr. J. Allen Hynek and Jacques Vallée in the 70’s. He became an active researcher only at the end of the 80’s, after becoming aware of new developments at that time, especially regarding Roswell, UFO secrecy, abductions and cattle mutilations. He became also interested in the historical, mythological and religious dimensions of the extraterrestrial issue. He is the author of six books and has been a speaker in several conferences, starting in Brazil in 1997, and in France, Italy, Great Britain, the United States and Ireland.

Gildas Bourdais.mp3

SEASON 3

3.2.08
316
Steve Bassett
(1 Hr 12 Min.)

Topics discussed:

• Changes in public perception for the UFO phenomenon
• The distinction between Ufology and Exopolitics
• The UFO connections for each of the remaining three candidates for US President (McCain, Obama, and Clinton)
• Why Steve thinks disclosure is possible for "Spring of 2009"
• His take on the Kucinich firestorm from last November and why it was good for the disclosure movement
• The changing stance of the media with regards to UFOs
• Steve's response to the "haters" who are anti-Exopolitics
• and tons more

We start out by getting Steve's take on the resurgence of interest in the UFO phenomenon, since his last appearance on the show in January of 2006, and what that means for Exopolitics. Steve segues from this to explaining the difference between Ufology and Exopolitics.

We move on from there to look at the 2008 Presidential election from an Exopolitical perspective. First, Steve gives us a rundown on how media coverage of the UFO phenomenon has changed rapidly in the last few years. He then explains the UFO connection for each of the three remaining candidates, John McCain and his role in investigating the Phoenix Lights, Barack Obama's campaign advisor Zbigniew Brzezinski's connection to the Carter Administration's UFO inquiries, and Hilary Clinton's ties to the Rockefeller Initiative for UFO information release.

From there, we look back at the Kucinich UFO debate question and the subsequent media fallout and Steve reassures binnall that it was a good thing and explains why it seemed like the "giggle factor" had been turned up after being relatively subdued during the bulk of '07's media coverage of UFOs.

We find out why Steve thinks Spring of 2009 is the next window of opportunity for a UFO disclosure event. He explains how the international situation is changing rapidly with regards to maintaining the UFO "truth embargo." We discuss how extensive the pre-planning would have to be for a disclosure type event and if Steve had heard any rumblings in that direction. Next we get Steve's take on the recent story of an alleged UN meeting about UFO disclosure.

Going back to look at the rise in media coverage of the UFO issue, we find out if Steve has noticed a difference in attitude from the media, based on his frequent mainstream TV and radio appearances. Steve responds to the concept that whomever is controlling the UFO secret is keeping the media from discussing it and he explains why that may not be the case in 2008.

Steve gives us his take on the Symington / Phoenix Lights story from last year and why it is a "microcosm of what's happening" in the Exopolitical scene. Next, we get Steve's response to the Exopolitics "haters" out there and he details why this tension is not surprising. This segues into a discussion on the long-standing concern that UFO disclosure would see the mainstream diminish the accomplishments of Ufologists who studied the phenomena for decades.

Getting some on-the-ground perspective, Steve tells us about the mood at the International UFO Congress in Laughlin, Nevada, where he is calling from. We also find out how the youth turnout is for the conference and Steve shares his candid perspective on the problem of the lack of young people interested in the UFO phenomenon.

BIOGRAPHY

Steve Bassett is a political activist, founder of Paradigm Research Group, Executive Director of the Extraterrestrial Phenomena Political Action Committee (X-PPAC, pronounced expack), author of the Paradigm Clock website, and a political columnist, commentator and former Independent candidate for Congress. He is the executive producer of the X-Conference.

Presently he is the only registered lobbyist in the United States representing extraterrestrial related phenomena research/activist organizations, and X-PPAC is the first political action committee to target the political implications of extraterrestrial related phenomena. Between April 19 and November 5 of 2002 he conducted an independent candidacy in the 2002 congressional campaign in the 8th District of Maryland. It was the first instance in which a candidate on the November ballot in a federal election openly addressed the matter of an extraterrestrial presence and the government imposed truth embargo.

Since 1996 Bassett has assisted a number of organizations and initiatives, which have been making the case for 1) an end to the government embargo on the truth surrounding an extraterrestrial presence and 2) open congressional hearings to take the testimony of former military and agency employees witness to extraterrestrial related events and evidence. He has spoken to millions of Americans about the likelihood and implications of a formal disclosure event.

His website is www.paradigmresearchgroup.org.

Steve Bassett.mp3

SEASON 3

12.30.07
311
Nick Redfern
(2 Hr 5 Min.)

Topics discussed:

• Discussion of his latest book "Memoirs of a Monster Hunter"
• What's behind the esoteric
• Ufology as a whole and the deification of Roswell
• Nick's field work in Texas and Puerto Rico
• The Chupacabra
• Bigfoot
• Ghost Lights
• UFOs
• The Loch Ness Monster
• Paul Kimball
• Alien Big Cats
• Crop circles
• The UK esoteric scene

For newcomers to the series, we start out with some biographical info on who Nick Redfern is and how he ended up writing about the esoteric. Nick talks about what went into the decision to make "Memoirs" a more personal book as opposed to a straight profile piece on various esoteric mysteries.

We dig into one of the big picture concepts in the book, Nick's thoughts on what is behind esoteric phenomena. This leads to a discussion on the splintering of esoterica and how that trend may be turning back towards a more unified field. We then talk about how Nick gets various leads on new stories and how he separates the proverbial wheat from the chaffe and determines which stories are worth investigating. He also tells us about trends in feedback and story leads he gets.

Nick then tells about his investigation of the Big Thicket in Texas, where he saw a ghost light. This leads to us talking about the strange effect, attributed to the Bigfoot, where witnesses are induced with feelings of overwhelming terror.

Next we cover the backlash, from within Ufology, to Nick's previous book "Bodysnatchers in the Desert". This segues into Nick talking about the problem of elevating Roswell to the "Holy Grail of Ufology" and how that could be tremendously detrimental to the UFO field. We discuss the whole issue of researchers having their set perspective on what the UFO phenomenon is all about and how failing to look outside of set comfort zones could cause good cases to fall through the cracks. Looking at the Roswell case as a whole, Nick speculates on why it seems like Roswell has become the lynchpin of the UFO scene. We talk about the big problems with Roswell, as a whole, and the potentially disastrous implications if Roswell gets disproven as a UFO crash.

Following that, we discuss Nick's two trips to Puerto Rico to investigate the Chupacabra, how they showed the evolution of his investigation into the mystery, and how the 2nd trip changed Nick's thoughts on what is going on in Puerto Rico. Nick shares some great stories about his two trips to PR, interviewing people with Chupacabra reports. We talk about some of the dangerous elements of taking a trip to a foreign land including the frightening bats in Puerto Rico.

We cover Nick's filming an episode of Penn and Teller's "Bullshit" and his experience dealing with media that begin with a skeptical approach. He also talks about the hazards of doing TV shows. We then look at one of the big themes of "Memoirs", the strange synchronistic events that seem to follow Nick around during his investigations.

Next we look at the big picture issue of comparing and contrasting UK field research v. US field research. Nick has done both and tells us about some of the key similarities and differences. We find out what esoteric mysteries Nick hasn't looked into yet and would like to examine more. Looking at another big picture issue, we talk about the "lost mysteries of esoterica", stories that were once wildly popular but have since become rather dormant.

After that is a fun segment where binnall presents some questions from BoA's Lesley and Regan Lee along with questions from our UK correspondent Richard in Wales. Richard queries about the Wales UFO flap of 1977 and the alien big cat phenomenon and binnall has a follow up regarding why it seems like the ABC phenomenon seemed to take off in England. We get Nick's take on deserts as breeding grounds for esoteric phenomena and the latest controversy over crop circles in England, courtesy of questions from Regan Lee. Following that, we find out, via Lesley's questions, about the Taos Bigfoot story from "Memoirs" and what Nick likes to do when he isn't trying to solve esoteric mysteries.

Wrapping it up, we find out if there is any news on the story from last year about the film rights being picked up for "Three Men Seeking Monsters". Finally, we find out from Nick what he has coming for 2008, including some new books, speaking engagements, and written work.

BIOGRAPHY

Nick Redfern started his writing career as an eighteen-year-old in 1982 on a British-based music, fashion, and entertainment magazine called "Zero." His interest in UFOs was prompted by his father, who worked on radar with the British Royal Air Force, and who was personally aware of several UFO encounters investigated by the British Government in the 1950s.

Nick is the author of several books on unsolved mysteries and UFOs: "A Covert Agenda;" "The FBI Files;" "Cosmic Crashes;" "Strange Secrets" (with Andy Roberts); "Three Men Seeking Monsters;" "Body Snatchers in the Desert;" "On the Trail of the Saucer Spies;" "Celebrity Secrets;" "Monkey Man;" and "Memoirs of a Monster Hunter". He has written for UFO Magazine; Fortean Times; Fate Magazine; and the British Daily Express newspaper.

Nick has spent weeks chasing the vampire-like Chupacabras in Puerto Rico for the Sci-Fi Channel and Canada's Space Channel; roamed around the old base at Roswell, New Mexico in search of decaying, smelly, alien corpses; tried to conjure up Tulpa-style thought-forms of Bigfoot, lycanthropes, and lake monsters in his home-country of England; and was once less-than-politely turned away from the fringes of Area 51, Nevada by a fat and humorless security guard.

His website is nickredfern.com

Nick Redfern.mp3

SEASON 3

12.23.07
310
Stanton Friedman
(1 Hr 29 Min.)

Topics discussed:

• A variety of elements pertaining to the Betty and Barney Hill abduction case
• The role of the case in getting people interested in the UFO phenomenon
• The importance of Dr. Simon to the veracity of the case
• Why the Star Map aspect is key to the whole story
• Ufological history
• The immediate post-Condon period of UFO studies and why things seemed to go so wrong for Ufology from there
• Esoteric elements to the Hill case
• His interest in pilot shoot-downs of UFOs in the 1950's
• His next book which he dubs his "Magnus Opus"
• and, of course, tons more

We kick things off with Stan talking about how he got interested in the Betty and Barney Hill case and the key significance of the Hill case to the greater picture of popularity for Ufology. Beating binnall to the punch, Stan answers the rhetorical question of "what's so special about the Hill case". This leads to some discussion on the importance of Dr. Benjamin Simon to the Hill case. Stan gives some background on Betty and Barney Hill and why they were a "special couple". Stan shares the story of how he ended up as consultant to the TV Movie about the Hill case in the the 1970's, by way of the US Air Force.

This leads to Stan talking about the Star Map element to the Hill case, including some great background on how he got involved in that aspect of the story and the evolution of the Star Map case. He also gives a great thumbnail look at what the Star Map is and how it came out of the Hill case. He also talks about how the Star Map is a key element to the Hill Case, since it would constitute new information that came from the abduction that was previously unknown. And all this is before binnall asks the first question.

We find out what the mood was like in Ufology as the Hill case was surfacing. This leads to Stan talking about the importance of dealing with the media with regards to UFO stories. This turns into a fascinating discussion on "apologist Ufologists" and how J. Allen Hynek was one. From here we get Stan's take on where things went wrong for Ufology, some great first hand perspective of the fall out from the publication of the Condon Report, and, most importantly, why things went wrong. He also shares a remarkable anecdote about J. Allen Hynek and Blue Book that provides a telling look at what was really going on with the US Air Force's study of UFOs.

Next Stan talks about the problem with most astronomers and how that, in turn, causes the media to be incorrect about the potential for UFOs. This segues into a discussion on Stan's masterful refutation of Carl Sagan claiming that "reproductability is the essence of science". Stan's response lays waste to the often used argument by skeptics who say that since UFO sightings can't be repeated then they can't be studied.

Jumping back to the Hills case, we talk about the Boston Traveler article that broke their story, against their wishes, to the mass public. This leads to talk about the book that resulted from the Boston Traveler article, "The Interrupted Journey", and how Dr. Simon had editorial control over the final content of the book. This leads to a bit of discussion on Betty's latter days in Ufology.

Looking at the big picture of trends in the esoteric, we talk about why it seems like the Hill case "fell off the radar" in the paranormal world over the last ten to twenty years. We also look at one the most bizarre elements to the Hill case, the "dried leaves / earrings incident" which occurred in November of 1961, two months after the abduction, and the big picture information we may be able to glean from this strange side story. This leads to some discussion on elements of the Hill case that give us information on what the aliens may have known, at the time, about humans, based on their actions during the abduction.

Moving into another realm, we talk with Stan about his interest in the stories of US planes scrambled to go after UFOs in the 1950's. Next we discuss Stan's take on the renewed debate in Ufology over the ETH theory v. interdimensional theories regarding where the UFOs originate.

Heading towards the close of the interview, Stan tells us about his "Magnus Opus" that he is working on now, his next book "UFOs and Science". We also find out if Stan has ever considered doing an autobiography in the future and what he'd like to do for a book after "UFOs and Science". We also find out what's coming up for Stan Friedman in 2008 and what foreign countries he'd like to speak at but hasn't had the chance to yet.

BIOGRAPHY

Stanton T. Friedman received B.S. and M.S. degrees in physics from the University of Chicago in 1955 and 1956. He was employed for 14 years as a nuclear physicist for such companies as GE, GM, Westinghouse, TRW Systems, Aerojet General Nucleonics, and McDonnell Douglas on such advanced, classified, eventually cancelled, projects as nuclear aircraft, fission and fusion rockets, and nuclear powerplants for space.

He has provided written testimony to Congressional Hearings, appeared twice at the UN, and been a pioneer in many aspects of Ufology including Roswell, Majestic 12, the Betty Hill-Marjorie Fish star map work; analysis of the Delphos, Kansas, physical trace case; crashed saucers, flying saucer technology and challenges to the S.E.T.I. (Silly Effort to InvestigateHe is the author of the books "TOP SECRET/MAJIC" and "Crash at Corona: The Definitive Study of the Roswell Incident". He is also the co-author of the new book "Captured", about the Betty and Barney Hill abduction case.

His website is stantonfriedman.com.

Stanton T. Friedman.mp3

SEASON 3

12.15.07
309
Nick Pope
(1 Hr 15 Min.)

Topics discussed:

• Nick's role in investigating UFO reports for the Ministry of Defence
• What's become of his post in the last few years
• The unique circumstances to his meteoric rise to fame in esoteric and mainstream circles
• How extensive his interraction was with US/UK UFO groups and other international officials during tenure as MOD UFO investigator
• The 1993 Cosford incident
• The UK UFO files
• What became of the "best cases" that Nick investigated
• The media firestorm surrounding his comments from last November
• His thoughts on 911
• Ufology v. Science
• and tons and tons more

We start things out by bringing newcomers up to date on who Nick Pope is and the story of his job at the UFO Project of the Ministry of Defence in the UK. Nick tells us about how the UFO Project for the MOD came about the 1950's. Nick considers why the UK UFO Project continued for so long after its US counterpart, Project Blue Book, was shut down in the early 1970's.

He speculates on why he received so much media attention in the UK, considering his predecessors were largely operating anonymously. Nick gives us an update on the status of the UK UFO Project since he left the post and provides the startling revelation of what he hears as far as where the Project is heading.

Looking back on Nick's tenure at the UFO Project, we find out how extensively he worked with the UK & US UFO Groups of the time. We also find out if Nick had any contemporaries within the other European governments who were charged with investigating UFO cases as well.

Nick gives us a pretty thorough look at the 1993 Cosford case which may be Britain's 2nd most famous UFO case. He also shares with us the US reaction to the UK's inquiries about the Cosford case. From there, we get Nick's perspective on the UK UFO scene nowadays, following the massive explosion in popularity in the 1990's. Nick talks about how the FOIA has caused somewhat of a sea change in British Ufology.

We find out what kind of information someone reporting a UFO would get back from MOD, once they had completed their investigation and what sort of information is contained in the UK UFO files.

Nick talks about what it is like to deal with some elements of Ufology who believe in a cover-up and want him to "blow the whistle" on it. This leads to a discussion on how it is disappointing that the Ufology world demonizes the government and military instead of trying to work with it.

Jumping back to Nick's time with the MOD UFO Project, he takes us through an average day there and how he'd go about investigating a case. Nick estimates that 80% of his cases were explainable, 15% had insufficient evidence, and 5% were unexplainable. We find out what became of those cases that fell into the 5% area and what elements usually constituted a case becoming one of the 5%.

Moving on, we talk about some of the other weird elements that Nick was tasked with investigating as part of the UFO Project, including cattle mutilations, crop circles, and ghosts at military bases. We find out how Nick investigated some of those strange cases. We also talk about Nick's interest and investigation into the abduction phenomenon.

We talk about Nick's criticism of the government for not having a plan of action in the event of an ET discovery, which segues into his take on the media firestorm that surrounded his sharing these criticisms late last year when he left the MOD. We get Nick's perspective on the Exopolitics movement that has sprung up in the last decade or so. We also talk about Nick's latest endeavor, engaging in debates over the events of 911 and taking the side of the US government's explanation for what happened on that fateful day. We also find out where Nick sees Ufology going in the future.

Wrapping it all up, we find out what's next for Nick Pope and what he thinks is the most important thing for Ufology to do as it goes forward.

BIOGRAPHY

Nick Pope used to run the British Government's UFO project at the Ministry of Defence. Initially sceptical, his research and investigation into the UFO phenomenon and access to formerly classified government files on the subject soon convinced him that the phenomenon raised important defence and national security issues, especially when the witnesses were military pilots or where UFOs were tracked on radar.

Nick also looked into other mysteries such as alien abductions, crop circles and ghosts. He now continues his research in a private capacity and is recognised as a leading authority on UFOs and the unexplained. He does extensive media work, lectures all around the world and has acted as consultant on numerous television documentaries.

His website is nickpope.net.

Nick Pope.mp3

SEASON 2

6.16.07
229
Robert Hastings
(1 Hr 15 Min.)

Topics discussed:

• Robert's take on this strange sub-section of Ufology
• His background
• how he decided to focus on the UFO-Nuke connection
• Key cases like the Malmstrom AFB case of 1967 and the Big Sur case of 1964
• Cases involving various levels of UFOs tampering with nuclear weapons
• Big picture speculation on what the UFO/nuke connection might mean
• And tons more

We kick things off by finding out a little bit about Robert's background and how he ended up gravitating towards the UFO subject. He also reveals his unique connection to the infamous Malmstrom AFB UFO sightings of 1967. We find out what made Robert decide to focus on the nuclear aspect of the UFO phenomenon. Robert tells us about the difficulties in finding military whistleblowers and in getting them to open up about their UFO sightings. He also tells of his attempts to get information from the government about these UFO/nuke sightings, via the FOIA.

We discuss Ufology's habit of turning on whistleblowers and we get Robert's take on this unfortunate habit of the field. We discuss how the strange theme of UFOs over nuclear bases is not isolated to just the 1940's, 50's, and '60's, but actually is seemingly still going on today.

Robert then talks about what he considers to be one of the top half dozen cases that he has studied, the 1964 Big Sur sighting. (Robert's CUFOS article on Big Sur (.pdf file)) We attempt to get a ballpark figure on how many UFO / nuclear base incidents that Robert has discovered so far. We also attempt to determine whether UFOs tinkering with the nuclear missiles is abnormal for UFO / nuclear base sightings (i.e. are they usually just observing and rarely get pro-active).

Based on what Robert's witnesses tell him, we find out what the reaction is of the "higher ups" in the chain of command to the UFO sightings over nuclear bases. Given that all evidence seems to support that the UFOs end up disabling the nuclear weapons, binnall inquires as to whether they've ever activated the nukes, instead. We find out if Robert has investigated any other UFO / nuke sightings occurring in other countries, outside of the US.

Getting totally speculative, we ask Robert what he thinks is going on behind these UFO sightings over nuclear bases. We move on to discuss the trend of the US military being pro-active about UFOs over nuclear bases and their attempts to thwart the UFOs via engaging them.

We move on from the UFO / nuke connection to talk about Robert's investigation of the Paul Bennewitz saga, during the mid-1980's. This segues into Robert's investigation of the MJ-12 documents and why he thinks they are fraudulent and who were the parties behind the disinformation. He also talks about how his investigation into MJ-12 ended up creating a firestorm amongst the parties he alleged were behind it all.

Heading towards the end, we find out Robert's take on how the UFO field has evolved over the last 30 years that he's been researching UFOs. We also get his take on the science v. activism debate that seems to be going on in Ufology today.

Wrapping it up, we find out when we can expect to be able to pick up Robert's book "The UFO / Nuke Connection". He also gives us the heads up on upcoming speaking engagements in New England, around late October.

BIOGRAPHY

Robert Hastings was born at Sandia Base, NM, May 6, 1950, during a period of high UFO activity at the base, and nearby Kirtland AFB. (That might explain a lot, he says, tongue firmly in cheek.)

His father, SMSgt. Robert E. Hastings was career Air Force, and the Hastings family were stationed at Malmstrom AFB in 1966-67, during one of the peak-periods of UFO activity at nearby ICBM sites. That's what sparked his interest in UFOs.

He received his BFA in Photography at Ohio University in 1972. He almost completed a masters program in Instructional Technology (media directed toward educational ends) but gave that up in 1981 to go out on the college lecture circuit to speak about the UFO/Nukes Connection. Thus far he has spoken at over 500 colleges and universities nationwide.

In 1986-88, he retrained in Electron Microscopy at San Joaquin Delta College in Stockton, CA, and received a certificate in Material Science applications. Between 1988 and 2002, he was employed as a laboratory analyst by Philips Semiconductors in Albuquerque, NM, but continued to lecture at colleges part-time, averaging 25-30 programs per year.

He is currently semi-retired, but still lectures on UFOs.

Robert Hastings.mp3

SEASON 2

6.9.07
228
Chris Styles
(1 Hr 25 Min.)

Topics discussed:

• The man who put the Shag Harbour Incident on the map of Ufology
• An in-depth look at what went down that fateful night in October of 1967
• What people thought the UFO was and how that contrasted with the government's interpretation of events
• The mysterious and skeptical Fr. Gafney
• The role of the media in covering the SHI as it happened
• We'll find out why he decided to investigate it
• Who and what were the key elements in his investigation
• Fascinating new details he discovered about the Shag Harbour Incident
• A simultaneous secret search
• Testimony of "beings" working on the downed craft
• Canadian X-Files

We kick things off by finding out a little bit of background on Chris Styles and how he gravitated towards the UFO phenomenon. Chris takes us back to October 4th, 1967 and gives us a thumbnail sketch of the UFO event that has come to be known as "The Shag Harbour Incident". We discuss the interesting aspect of the SHI, where the general population who saw the object thought it was a downed airplane, while the government called it a "UFO". Chris explains why many in the population probably didn't consider the possibility that it could be a downed UFO. Chris talks about the "Oz Factor" and how that can influence a UFO investigation.

We talk about one of the key players in the UFO field in Canada at the time : Father Burt Gafney, a strong skeptic of the UFO phenomenon, who did research on the subject at the behest of the Canadian government. We move on to discuss the sensational media coverage of the Incident, at the time, and the rumours and theories of a cover-up of the incident.

Jumping ahead to 25 years later, we find out what made Chris decide to resurrect the Shag Harbour Incident. Chris tells us the path his research took, some of the key people who advised him on how to begin the investigation, how the nature of Shag Harbour allowed him to find the witnesses before he'd even received any documents from the government, and how the documents he did receive ended up showing how serious the incident was taken by the Canadian government.

Chris tells us about the pilot testimony that he discovered, amongst the documents, that tells of pilots sighting a UFO, in the vicinity of Shag Harbour, a few hours before the incident happened. He goes on to explain how the night of October 4th could be called "The Night of UFOs" in Eastern Canada. We find out about the availability of the documents that Chris discovered, were they freely available in 1967 or did they only get released more recently ?

This segues into a fascinating discussion on Canada's "X-Files", legitimate government files, bearing the designation of "X", that existed "outside of the system" and were not catalouged by the government. Chris tells us how he first discovered these X-Files, in a truly remarkable and ironic way. We find out if the government tried to re-sieze the X-Files that Chris discovered, since they were presumably still classified. Chris talks about the APRO report on Shag Harbour that provided him with a wealth of information that went beyond what he found in government files.

From there, we discuss the recently discovered, simultaneous, second search for a UFO that was going on about 25 miles away from Shag Harbour, which was going on in-secret. This, in turn, takes us to a discussion on the testimony of the divers at this second search site, who saw the craft underwater and saw "beings lending assistance to the craft". Chris tells us about how this aspect of the case remains the most difficult part to get details on and he recounts his face-to-face interviews with the divers and their reactions to getting pressed for details on what they saw underwater during the search.

Chris explains how extensive the US military was involved in investigating the Shag Harbour Incident. We talk about the "race with the undertaker" problem that plagues Roswell research and we find out how much of that "race" as affected Shag Harbour research. As principal investigator of Shag Harbour, how does Chris feel about dealing with ill-informed media trying to investigate the case and skeptics who conveniently omit facts to bolster their case against Shag Harbour.

He tells us about a new case, from 1990, in Prince Edward Island, Canada, which could turn out to be a very strong UFO case. Heading towards the end of the interview, we discuss Canadian Ufology v. American Ufology and how similar or different their individual evolutions have been.

Wrapping it up, we find out what's next for Chris Styles, including an appearance at the Massachusetts MUFON event on October 12th, 2007. He also reflects on how big the Shag Harbour Incident got and what the reaction has been from the townspeople of Shag Harbour.

BIOGRAPHY

Chris Styles is an active UFO researcher who investigates both classic and current UFO incidents that have occurred in Atlantic Canada. He is best known for his work on the Shag Harbour Incident of October 4, 1967. His work on the Shag Harbour Incident has had a great impact on how UFO crash scenarios are viewed within the field of Ufology. In 1993 Chris received a modest research grant from the Washington based group The Fund for UFO Research, which helped underwrite the expense on an on site research effort at Canada’s National Archives in Ottawa

In 1995 Styles directed an underwater search for physical evidence that may have remained on the seabed of Shag Harbour. That effort was funded by Paramount Television and resulted in several segments for their syndicated show "Sightings". He has appeared in several US documentaries such as the 120 minute A & E production "UFOs II, Have We Been Visited?"

Chris did much of the on screen work and served as a technical advisor in several Canadian UFO feature documentaries such as Ocean Entertainment’s "The Shag Harbour Incident" and "Northern Lights", a 2 hour feature production of Roadhouse Films. His most recent on camera appearance was in the US History Channel’s 60 minute feature documentary "UFO Files – Canada’s Roswell", which was first broadcast in March, 2006.

In 2001 Chris co-authored "Dark Object" with fellow UFO researcher Don Ledger. He has published several speculative papers on different aspects of UFO research and has presented at various UFO symposia. He can be reached via E-mail at shagharbour@hotmail.com.

Chris Styles.mp3

SEASON 2

4.28.07
224
Michael Salla
(1 hr 22 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Exopolitics
• The goals of Exopolitics, its tenuous relationship with Ufology
• Salla responds to some of the critics of the movement
• 911
• The Symington Phoenix Lights story
• The recent release of French UFO documents (and Salla's surprising response)
• and tons more

We kick things off by getting some background on what Exopolitics is and what the goals are behind Exopolitics. We discuss how many people in Exopolitics come from Ufology, but that there is still a faction of anti-exopolitics leaning people in the field and how Michael sees Exopolitics overcoming this factioning and how Exopolitics is markedly different from Ufology. We get Michael's response to the critics of exopolitics, who are jaded by the activism or take issues with some of the whistleblower testimony cited by those in Exopolitics.

Harkening back to some of binnall's complaints about Ufology, we find out if there are specific benchmarks that the Exopolitical movement is aiming for, from both a scholastic and political point of view. We discuss whether or not the present political system is conducive to a pro-UFO candidate or point of view.

We find out where Michael sees Exopolitics fitting into a post-UFO Disclosure world and how it plans to prevent the marginalization and redundancy that many in Ufology expect to happen to the field, post-disclosure. We talk about how "proving UFOs are real" may turn out to be the death knell for Ufology, post-UFO disclosure. Michael explains his problem with framing the "UFO question" on a strictly scientific basis.

From there, we discuss one of the recent papers on exopolitics.org, "False Flag Operations, 911, and the Exopolitical Perspective". Michael explains what motivated him to write this piece, which is somewhat outside the usual UFO realm of exopolitics. He also talks about why the 911 researchers don't want to touch Ufology and we discuss the differences between these two fields of inquiry. We talk about how the freshness of 911 helps to override the ridicule factor that has dogged Ufology for decades.

Then we talk about the recent UFO media flap and what the exopolitical take on this flap is, specifically Michael talks about the Gov. Symington / Phoenix Lights story that exploded on the scene a few weeks ago. We also get his take on the anti-Symington sentiment within Ufology.

After that, we talk about the recent release of UFO information from the French government and Michael explains why he feels ambivalent to the story. We get his exopolitical take on the 2008 presidential election and Hillary Clinton.

Heading towards the end, we discuss the Exopolitics Institute, what it is and what it's goals are. That segues into a discussion about what to do, should there be disclosure, with government officials who are complicite with the UFO cover up. Michael also gives us a preview of the Earth Transformation Conference, to be held in Hawaii this May.

BIOGRAPHY

Dr. Michael E. Salla, is a pioneer in the development of exopolitics, the scholarly study of the main actors, institutions and processes associated with an extraterrestrial presence that is not acknowledged to the general public, elected officials or the mass media. His interest in exopolitics evolved out of his investigation of the sources of international conflict and its relationship with the undisclosed extraterrestrial presence. His groundbreaking Exopolitics: Political Implications of the Extraterrestrial Presence (Dandelion Books, 2004) presents the first scholarly framework for understanding the political implications of the extraterrestrial presence.

Dr. Salla is an internationally recognized scholar in international politics, conflict resolution and US foreign policy. He has also authored more than seventy articles, chapters, and book reviews on peace, ethnic conflict and conflict resolution. He has held academic appointments in the School of International Service & the Center for Global Peace, American University, Washington DC (1996-2004); the Department of Political Science, Australian National University, Canberra, Australia (1994-96); and the Elliott School of International Affairs, George Washington University, Washington D.C., (2002). He has a PhD in Government from the University of Queensland, Australia, and an MA in Philosophy from the University of Melbourne, Australia. He has conducted research and fieldwork in the ethnic conflicts in East Timor, Kosovo, Macedonia, and Sri Lanka, and organized peacemaking initiatives involving mid to high level participants from these conflicts.

His website is www.exopolitics.org.

Dr. Michael E. Salla.mp3

SEASON 2

2.10.07
215
John Greenewald
(1 hr 6 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Ufology and young people and why the field isn't attracting them
• Advice he has for newcomers
• Who was instrumental in his early days in Ufology and a variety of other facets of this pressing issue
• Project Preserve History
• His new podcast series from blackvault.com

We talk about lack of young people in Ufology and what can be done to fix this problem. He tells us about his first big interview with NBC when he was just 17 and how Ufology's lack of "coolness" in the mainstream hurts the field, when it comes to drawing in younger people. He reflects on the scene at UFO conventions and how they provide a great outlet for people interested in the phenomenon.

John talks about how he tailors his UFO television work to address this problem of Ufology's public perception. He also emphasizes the need for newcomers to be more persistent in the face of potential "shunning" from those already inside the field of Ufology. John addresses binnall's theory that the 911 Truth Movement is drawing away young people from Ufology.

John observes how young people could improve Ufology, by bringing a fresh perspective to the subject. He also addresses how he is trying to change Ufology through his work. He points out that at this point there is another generation of people coming along, younger that John, that Ufology needs to appeal to. We talk about two somewhat problematic aspects to Ufology drawing young people : potential career problems with being a part of UFO studies and the potential for contributing a lifetime to the field and never getting any solid answers. This segues into a discussion on the legacy J. Allen Hynek and how the early generation of Ufologists paved the way for future generations.

From there, we find out about John's experience breaking into Ufology as a young person and some of the key people who helped him get acclimated to Ufology. He addresses one of the big challenges for anyone getting into Ufology and what he recommends for newcomers in Ufology. We talk about what sets Ufology apart from some other areas of research, both helping and hindering the field.

Moving on, we talk about blackvault.com's Project Preserve History. John talks about some of the cool historical material being collected by the Project via blackvault.com visitors. He also discusses the strange trend in UFO historical records being lost and ending up on ebay.

John tells us about the return of Black Vault Radio Network, why he decided to bring it back and what we can expect from it in the future. Wrapping it up, he tells us what's coming up in the new year for blackvault.com and the goal for the end of 2007 with the website.

On a final note, John talks about a couple of his TV projects that are re-airing amongst the schedule on the History Channel, "Alien Encounters" and "UFO Files : Hangar 18".

BIOGRAPHY

John Greenewald, Jr. is a research/activist who began researching government conspiracies at the age of 15, and wrote his first book Beyond UFO Secrecy at 20. Over the last ten years, he has developed his website, blackvault.com, into one of the internet's premiere resources for esoteric information in the form of declassified government documents obtained via the FOIA.

Blackvault.com is the largest online community of its kind in the world with over 440,000 declassified government documents, over 15,000 archived news articles, and over 14,000 photographs of military aircraft and UFOs. It has been called one of the largest technological achievements on the internet and has won over 60 awards.

John Greenewald is also an accomplished television producer, having helped create a variety of programs for The History Channel, Discovery Channel, National Geographic Channel and many others. He is also the host of a twice weekly podcast series, Black Vault Radio.

His website is, of course, www.blackvault.com.

John Greenewald, Part 2.mp3

SEASON 2

2.3.07
214
John Greenewald
(1 hr 4 min.)

Topics discussed:

• How John got interested in Ufology
• The origins of blackvault.com
• The ins and outs of the FOIA
• The government's reaction to John's work
• Ufology on the Internet
• and tons more regarding the esoteric institution that is blackvault.com

We kick things off with some discussion on how John got interested in the UFO phenomenon and how blackvault.com started. From there, we talk about blackvault.com's goal of "bringing organization to an unorganized world" of government secrecy and the inherent problems when you receive documents from FOIA requests. John reveals the stunning percentage of documents that came from his own FOIA requests and he explains the fee structure for FOIA requests and how blackvault.com pays for the fees acrued by those requests.

Moving on, we talk about the latest news regarding retroactive reclassification of previously released documents and if this has affected the blackvault.com's archive. John tells us how he determines which documents to request and how the nature of the process ends up causing more requests. John talks about his relationship with the government over the years and if there is much backlash because of his numerous FOIA requests.

After a lengthy discussion on the UFO material at blackvault.com, we find out what other areas John finds to be particularly interesting amongst the documents, notably the infamous MK Ultra. We also cover FBI files on Ufologists and debunkers and John's attempt to get his FBI file.

Wrapping up this week's installment, we discuss the evolution of the internet, getting John's perspective on ten years of working in the medium. From there, we get John's thoughts on Ufology and the internet and why blackvault.com has stayed so viable all these years. He also talks about the plusses and minuses of Ufology on the Internet, how it helps the researchers but may hinder the field as a whole.

BIOGRAPHY

John Greenewald, Jr. is a research/activist who began researching government conspiracies at the age of 15, and wrote his first book Beyond UFO Secrecy at 20. Over the last ten years, he has developed his website, blackvault.com, into one of the internet's premiere resources for esoteric information in the form of declassified government documents obtained via the FOIA.

Blackvault.com is the largest online community of its kind in the world with over 440,000 declassified government documents, over 15,000 archived news articles, and over 14,000 photographs of military aircraft and UFOs. It has been called one of the largest technological achievements on the internet and has won over 60 awards.

John Greenewald is also an accomplished television producer, having helped create a variety of programs for The History Channel, Discovery Channel, National Geographic Channel and many others. He is also the host of a twice weekly podcast series, Black Vault Radio.

His website is, of course, www.blackvault.com.

John Greenewald, Part 1.mp3

SEASON 2

12.30.06
213
James Carrion
(1 hr 1 min.)

Topics discussed:

• James' plans as the new leader of the organization
• The road to Jim becoming new MUFON director
• New initiatives to improve MUFON's public relations and draw in younger members
• Carrion's long term goals for MUFON
• The organization's "end game" plan in event of UFO disclosure
• Response to critics of MUFON
• and tons more

We kick things off with James telling us about his background and how he became interested in the UFO phenomenon. We follow the trajectory of James's career with MUFON, including the Pandora Project (turning MUFON's vast library of files from paper to digital). We talk about the origins and history of MUFON, including some fascinating details surrounding the creation of the organization. James talks about the evolution of MUFON, including two new goals adopted rather recently.

James tackles the difficult question of where MUFON stands on what UFOs are. He discusses a groundbreaking series of closed door workshops, beginning in 2007, to discuss just this question. We discuss the ebbs and flows of MUFON membership and how the organization is holding up today. We talk about the average age of a MUFON member and what strides the organization is making to appeal to younger members, including an exciting new development that may help develop a younger generation of MUFON members. Closing out the general MUFON discussion, we talk about the international structure of MUFON.

The conversation turns to Carrion's new job as International Director of MUFON, starting with what kind of duties the job encompasses. He discusses what direction he would like to take MUFON during his tenure as International Director. James talks about what initiatives are in store for raising the public image of MUFON. We talk about if James will be handling national media appearances as new MUFON head and we get his take on the usual skeptics that are thrown on as the "opposing view".

In light of his work with MUFON files, James becomes the latest guest to be asked about the infamous missing APRO documents. We find out more details on this fascinating story. Concerning the MUFON file database, James talks about the status of their availability to the general public and researchers.

We get a response from James to the critics, within Ufology, who want MUFON to be more politically active. Does MUFON have an end game plan for if/when UFO disclosure happens ? We talk about if MUFON has a resident historian, of sorts, to document the evolution of the field. How does James respond to the general paranoia that an esoteric organization would be infiltrated by intelligence agencies (ala NICAP).

James takes us through the basic structure of a state level MUFON organization and how individual UFO sightings are investigated by MUFON. We discuss what the relationship is between MUFON and the National UFO Reporting Center. James talks about the problems today with trying to correlate UFO reports. Crazies in Ufology, its a sad fact of life, how much do they affect MUFON and do they have any form of policing members.

Moving on, we talk about the MUFON journal and what kind of content is in it. We find out if the MUFON journal fits the need for peer-review in Ufology. From there, we talk about the MUFON Symposium, including what this year's theme will be, goals for the conference, who determines speakers at the Symposium and new changes in that policy. James also talks about potential plans for future sites for the MUFON Symposium. Also, binnall implores James to bring the MUFON conference to the East Coast.

James tells us what's next for MUFON, including five key projects they have planned. James talks about MUFON's history studying the abduction phenomenon, including the Ambient Project. We talk about the internal debate within MUFON over abductions and some of the other debates that have gone on within MUFON's ranks.

Wrapping it up, James tells us why people should join MUFON and how they can.

BIOGRAPHY

James began his lifelong interest with the UFO phenomenon at the age of 11 when he began his own UFO news clipping collection. As a young boy, James lived in Puerto Rico at a time when the island was a hotbed of UFO activity and he later researched the Chupacabra and Laguna Cartagena sightings. James served for four years as a U.S. Army Russian Linguist in the Military Intelligence Corps and became fascinated with the story of the Gulf Breeze six, a group of young Military Intelligence soldiers that went AWOL from their base in Augsburg, Germany to search for UFOs in Gulf Breeze.

Upon moving to Colorado in 1996, James joined the Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) and worked as the state section director for both North Eastern and North Western Colorado. James proposed and implemented MUFON’s Pandora Project, the electronic archiving of all MUFON’s UFO case files and served on the MUFON International Business Board for three years before being elected as the MUFON International Director in 2006. James holds a Bachelors of Arts in Russian Language and a Masters of Arts in International Affairs, both from Florida State University. James is also the CEO of a national computer training company and is widely recognized as a computer expert. James currently lives in Bellvue, Colorado with his wife Lisa and son Aidan.

His website is mufon.com.

James Carrion.mp3

SEASON 2

12.23.06
212
Stanton Friedman
(1 hr 8 min.)

Topics discussed:

• An in-depth discussion on his early years in Ufology
• The evolution of his career as a speaker on flying saucers
• The 1968 Congressional investigation into UFOs
• The NICAP v. APRO feud
• What to do about the lack of young people in Ufology

We kick things off with Stanton telling us about his attempt to investigate the Roswell case in the early 1970's, a handful of years before he was put in touch with Jesse Marcel and the Roswell investigation began in earnest. Following that, Stan gives an in-depth look at the very beginnings of his interest in the UFO phenomenon. He talks about what part of Project Blue Book, Special Report 14 particularly interested him upon reading it (aside from all the data).

He shares with us early advice he got on getting involved in studying UFOs, what key figure in early Ufology was instrumental in the early days of his career as a Ufologist, an interesting coicidence that really got the ball rolling on his lecturing on flying saucers. He gives some background on what he considers some of his crucial talks in the early days. He discusses the early rules he had from his employers with regards to his then-side career as speaker on flying saucers. He tells us what convinced him to pursue his UFO speaking career after the bottom fell out of the nuclear system business.

We talk about the 1968 Congressional committee that discussed the UFO phenomenon. He tells us what other key figure in early Ufology was instrumental putting it together and how Stan ended up being one of the 12 specialists who contributed to the committee. He talks about what came out of the study, what made it different from the previous Congressional inquiry into UFOs, and whose paper was a "turning point" for him.

He talks about the mood within Ufology during this time. We discuss the Condon Report that came out shortly after the Congressional. Stan gives us his first hand account of the immediate effect of the Condon Report within Ufology. He talks about some of the aspects that have helped his speaking career and some general observations regarding people's perceptions of the UFO phenomenon, based on his hundreds of presentations over the years.

Stan talks about the NICAP v. APRO feud, some of the key differences between the two groups and their distinct perspectives on how to tackle the UFO phenomenon. He talks about his dealings with NICAP from the perspective of his group in Pittsburgh at the time. He also talks about how he helped APRO to investigate part of the Bettie Hill starmap case. He talks about some of the differences in membership between the two groups. We talk about the BoA : Audio pet question regarding the missing APRO documents and Stan sheds some light on this story.

We get Stan's take on the lack of young people in Ufology and how to get them interested. He talks about what has changed over the years and has caused this atrophy of youth interest. He tells us what Ufology needs to do more of in order to bring in more young researchers.

We wrap it up with a brief discussion on his ongoing request for information on any pilots who went missing while chasing UFOs, what kind of information this request has borne out so far, and what got him interested in this aspect of the UFO phenomenon.

BIOGRAPHY

Stanton T. Friedman received B.S. and M.S. degrees in physics from the University of Chicago in 1955 and 1956. He was employed for 14 years as a nuclear physicist for such companies as GE, GM, Westinghouse, TRW Systems, Aerojet General Nucleonics, and McDonnell Douglas on such advanced, classified, eventually cancelled, projects as nuclear aircraft, fission and fusion rockets, and nuclear powerplants for space.

He has provided written testimony to Congressional Hearings, appeared twice at the UN, and been a pioneer in many aspects of Ufology including Roswell, Majestic 12, the Betty Hill-Marjorie Fish star map work; analysis of the Delphos, Kansas, physical trace case; crashed saucers, flying saucer technology and challenges to the S.E.T.I. (Silly Effort to Investigate) cultists.

He is the author of the books "TOP SECRET/MAJIC" and "Crash at Corona: The Definitive Study of the Roswell Incident"

His website is www.stantonfriedman.com.

Stanton T. Friedman.mp3

SEASON 2

11.18.06
207
Peter Davenport
(1 hr 38 min.)

Topics discussed:

• We talk about the National UFO Reporting Center
• How Peter ended up as director
• His thoughts on taking so many UFO reports, hoaxers
• UFOs and the media
• The government and UFOs
• Some of Peter's "best cases"
• A thorough look at the infamous Todd Sees case
• Plus, of course, tons more

We start out by getting some background on Peter Davenport and how he came to become interested in the UFO phenomenon in the first place and his evolution as a UFO researcher. We find out the story of how Peter came to become head of the National UFO Reporting Center. He also talks about how the UFO Reporting Center has changed his view of reality.

We discuss any trends that Peter may have noticed from his years of taking UFO reports. Given the advances in technology, is Peter seeing more older cases being reported that had previously gone unreported. He also talks about the phenomenon of people not reporting UFO sightings or being afraid to report UFO sightings.

Peter tells us what is the most pertinent information to gather after a UFO sighting. We find out whether or not modern technology has produced better UFO reports and how modern technology has also hurt the National UFO Reporting Center.

We talk about hoax callers, and hoaxers in general, and what he thinks motivates the hoaxers. Peter also tells a great story of how he dealt with one particular hoaxer who called the hotline. He also talks about the latest idea to try and fend off teenage pranksters who are harassing the NUFORC. On the other end of that spectrum, we ask Peter why more young people aren't gravitating towards Ufology like they were in the past.

Peter talks about some of favorite "best cases" that he's received at the NUFORC, including the Pheonix Lights, the Saint Clair County, Illinois case from January of 2005, an amazing elk abduction by a UFO in 1999 that was seen by 14 witnesses, and quite a few other fascinating cases. We find out what Peter thinks of the "black triangle phenomenon", which has emerged over the last decade or so.

Regarding reports coming from pilots, Peter talks about some of the most memorable cases he has gotten. Does Peter think the chill put over pilots reporting UFOs has begun to thaw. He also talks about an intriguing meeting his had with government officials in 1997.

Peter goes in-depth on the riveting Todd Sees case from 2004, which may have possibly been the first documented human death related to a UFO. He also discusses his proposal for a Passive Radar system to detect UFOs and gives an update on this proposal since it's origination in 2004.

Peter speculates on what the government's role is with regards to the UFO phenomenon. He also talks about the lackluster coverage of the UFO phenomenon by the mainstream media. We also get Peter's take on the ABC UFO special, on which he was featured prominently.

We ask Peter what direction does Ufology, as a science, need to go from here and he gives us his point-by-point take on what developments need to happen for the field to evolve. We find out what Peter's response is to those in Ufology who say we have to move on from "lights in the sky."

We wrap it up with an update on Peter's move to a former ICBM missile site this past Summer and how the listeners can help the National UFO Reporting Center.

BIOGRAPHY

Peter Davenport, Director of the National UFO Reporting Center since July 1994, was born in St. Louis, Missouri, where he lived to the age of 14. As a boy, he attended high school in St. Louis, Ethiopia, and New Hampshire.

Peter received his undergraduate education at Stanford University in California, where he earned bachelor’s degrees in both Russian and biology, and a translator’s certificate in Russian. His graduate education was completed at the University of Washington in Seattle, where he earned an M.S. degree in the genetics and biochemistry of fish from the College of Fisheries, as well as an M.B.A. degree in finance and international business from the Graduate School of Business.

Peter has worked as a college instructor, a commercial fisherman, a Russian translator in the Soviet Union, a fisheries observer aboard Soviet fishing vessels, a flight instructor (gliders), and a businessman. Peter was the founding president of a Seattle-based biotechnology company, which, at one time, employed over 300 scientists and technicians.

Peter has had an active interest in the UFO phenomenon from his early boyhood. He experienced his first UFO sighting over the St. Louis municipal airport in the summer of 1954, and he investigated his first UFO case during the summer of 1965 in Exeter, New Hampshire. Peter has been witness to several anomalous events, possibly UFO related, including a dramatic sighting over Baja California in February 1990, and several nighttime sightings over Washington State during 1992.

In addition to being the Director of the National UFO Reporting Center, Peter is a current member of MUFON, and is a former Co-State Section Director (King County), and former Director of Investigation, for the Washington State chapter of MUFON.

His website is www.ufocenter.com.

Peter Davenport.mp3

SEASON 2

11.4.06
206
Paola Harris
(2 hrs 28 mins.)

Topics discussed:

• Her early influences like J. Allen Hynek, Philip Corso, and John Mack
• Ufology & Exopolitics
• Italian / European Ufology v. its American counterpart
• Ufology's 'next generation' woes
• The Charles Halls ET story
• The difficulties in applying mainstream science to the UFO enigma
• And, of course, tons more !

We start out by getting some background on Paola and how she got interested in the UFO phenomenon, including the serendipitous events that brought her to J. Allen Hynek. She talks about what it was like studying under Hynek, who served as an early mentor for her. We also get some insight into Hynek's mindset as he neared the end of his life. Continuing our discussion on Paola's early influences, we talk about her close friendship with Col. Philip Corso and the strange turn of events that resulted in her meeting Corso for the first time.

She talks about what shocked her the most about the Corso story and also talks about Corso's trips to Italy. She responds to the criticism of the Corso story from many in Ufology. she also clears up the story of a second Corso book written in Italian, titled "Dawn of a New Age".

Continuing the discussion on some of Paola's early influences, we talk about her close friendship with Dr. John Mack. We also talk about her friend Monsignor Corrado Balducci, what he found to be the most important part of the UFO study and Balducci's thoughts on what the Bible says about UFOs. Wrapping up the discussion of early influences in Paola's research career, we talk about Clifford Stone, his story and his reaction to being a whistleblower in the field of Ufology.

Moving on from there, we find out Paola's perspective on American Ufology today and how the exopolitical movement has changed her focus and rejuvinated her UFO research, including what she calls a groundbreaking meeting with Paul Hellyer. She compares the European Ufology scene compared to its American counterpart. She talks about how the infighting in Ufology and the lack of cohesion is a big problem facing American Ufology today.

We find out Paola's perspective on being a woman in the field of Ufology. Paola also talks about the need for a more global perspective on the UFO phenomenon. She also talks about how the lack of money in Ufology prevents good field research. Does Paola see Ufology going towards the exopolitical stance in the future ? We talk about the evolution of the Italian UFO scene since the early 1900's. We find out the extent of public government investigation of UFOs in Italy. Paola explains what the situation is in Italy as far as UFO organizations like the US's MUFON. She gives an example of how a typical UFO case is handled in Italy as comparison to America. Paola explains how the general public in Europe sees the UFO phenomenon and how the rich history of the region may has shaped that perspective. Since Paola is situated so close to the Vatican, binnall tries to get some word on the inside buzz on the papacy's take on the UFO phenomenon.

Did J. Allen Hynek give any perspective on "Close Encounters of the Third Kind" and the rumoured government influences on the film. This segues into a discussion on disclosure and if disclosure played out how it would start outside the US first. We continue our discussion on ufo disclosure, how Paola sees it playing out and is she optimistic to see disclosure in her lifetime. Paola lays out situations where we may see ETs reveal themselves and take UFO disclosure out of human hands. We find out what does Paola thinks the reaction to that would be and what she hopes would never happen in such a scenario.

Paola explains the need to expand and evolve science around the UFO phenomenon, instead of trying to squeeze Ufology into contemporary science. Paola tells us about her interview with Paul Hellyer and the discussion they had on the UFO phenomenon. Paola responds to the critics of the Hellyer story who claim he is basing everything on "The Day After Roswell". She talks about how the Hellyer story is an example of the trend of attacking newcomers in the field of Ufology.

We get an update on the Brazilian disclosure story that broke in April of 2005 and hasn't gotten much publicity in the time since it became news. She gives an example of research being done in conjunction between American and Brazilian UFO researchers and how that is a trend of "global Ufology" that she'd like to see develop more. We talk about how there seems to be no solution to solving the lack of funding available for UFO research.

The conversations moves on to talking about the lack of a younger generation in Ufology, why hasn't the field generated more interest from young people and why that trend is different outside of the US. Paola details the Italian Ufology scene's perspective of US Ufology. We discuss if there resentment or frustration in European Ufology circles over the US Ufology community and what is a major misconception in Europe as to what the US knows about UFOs.

We get an update on the Charles Hall story that Paola was involved with in early 2005. She extrapolates on why she thinks it is a very important study of galactic diplomacy. This segues to discussing the SERPO story and we find out what Paola thinks of it.

Given Paola's scope of international UFO interest, we find out if she's heard any buzz coming out of China, Japan, or other parts of Asia regarding the UFO phenomenon. She tell us what country in that part of the world is really picking up on the esoteric right now.

We find out how Paola decides, as a researcher, which cases are worth investigating. Paola talks about what cases she'd like to research. She also talks about what she's working on right now that excites her more than any particular UFO case and, also, what new area of research she'd like to explore. She also talks about her slate of European conference appearances for the Fall.

Paola gives a preview of her next book, "How Does One Speak to a Ball of Light : Exopolitical Implications for Future Contact" and when she hopes it will be available. She also previews a new exopolitics based website that she is developing.

BIOGRAPHY

Paola Harris is an Italo-American photojournalist and investigative reporter in the field of extraterrestrial related phenomena research. She is also a widely published, free-lance writer, especially in Europe. She has studied extraterrestrial related phenomena since 1979 and is on personal terms with many of the leading researchers in the field. From 1980-1986 she assisted Dr. J. Allen Hynek with his UFO investigations and has interviewed many top military witnesses concerning their involvement in the government truth embargo.

In 1997, Ms. Harris met and interviewed Col. Philip Corso in Roswell, New Mexico and became a personal friend and confidante. She was instrumental in having his book The Day After Roswell, for which she wrote the preface, translated into Italian. She returned to Roswell in the summer of 2003 for the American debut of her book, Connecting the Dots…making sense of the UFO Phenomena, published by Granite Press.

Because of her international perspective on extraterrestrial related phenomena and her work with Dr. J. Allen Hynek, Paola has consulted with many researchers about the best avenues for planetary disclosure with emphasis on the “big picture” and stressing the historical connection.

Her website is www.paolaharris.it.

Paola Harris.mp3

SEASON 2

10.28.06
205
Scott Corrales
(1 hr 15 min.)

Topics discussed:

• We cover the chupacabra from a plethora of different angles
• It's physical appearance and traits
• Paranormal elements to the Chupa
• The sociological aspect of the mid-90's Chupacabra wave
• The potential Chupa migration
• Why they seem to come in waves
• The startling count of dead animals that may be Chupa related and tons more
• Latin American Ufology
• Scott's early influences
• The differences between US and Latin UFO research
• The strange allure of NASA to Latin countries
• Why Mexico seems to be a UFO hotbed
• and much more

We kick things off by getting some background on Scott Corrales and how he came to study the esoteric. He provides some fascinating perspective on the impact the US space program had on his community growing up. He also discusses his early mentors, Pedro Ferriz and Salvador Freixedo, two giants of Mexican Ufology. We talk about the evolution of his work and how it led to studying the Chupacabra.

Scott gives us a thorough look at the remarkable physical desciption of the Chupacabra. We find out if there was a history of the Chupacabra in the historical record of either the Latin culture or esoterica, in-general. Amongst this discussion, we talk about the possibility that the Chupacabra could be some kind of insect. Also discussed is the strange trend of what appear to be 20 year gaps between possible Chupacabra flaps.

We get an in-depth look at the massive Chupacabra flap in Puerto Rica of the mid-1990's, including the pop culture sensation that was the Chupacabra, the evolution of Chupa sightings throughout the island during this time, and the infamous posse of Mayor Soto, a Puerto Rican politician who led civilian Chupa hunters. We talk about the unique nature of the Chupacabra, as far as cryptozoological animals, in that they are known for their aggresssion.

Corrales covers the strange migration of the Chupacabra, or Chupa variations, to various parts of the world after the mid-1990's Chupa flap. From there, we cover the wide array of paranormal elements connected to the Chupacabra. He also talks about the line of research where psychics examined Chupacabra evidence and give their feedback. Scott gives us the lowdown on purported Chupacabra evidence in the form of eggs and hair.

We cover the biggest "bone of contention" for Chupa skeptics : the lack of photographic evidence for the Chupacabra. We cover the various branches of thought regarding just what the Chupacabra is (animal, ET, human experiment gone awry, interdimensional being, etc.) Scott talks about how NASA is held is such high regard in Latin countries and this allows for more sureptitious activity for various government agencies operating under the cover of being NASA.

This segues into a discussion of the long standing rumours of US government having mysterious doings in Puerto Rico. And we wrap up the Chupa talk with what the latest news is on the Chupacabra and whether or not it has fizzled out after the mid-90's wave.

Moving on to a discussion on Ufology, Scott compares the Latin American UFO scene to its American counterpart. He talks about a strong "about face" that has overcome the Latin UFO scene, where the field is becoming highly skeptical of the UFO phenomenon. He talks about how the Internet may have hurt the field of Latin Ufology. We find out if the mainstream perception and media is also becoming more skeptical.

Scott talks about what is going on down in Mexico, which is appears to be a hotbed of UFO activity. This leads us to a discussion of Scott's "Inexplicata : The Journal of Mexican Ufology", how it evolved and what it has become today. We find out what Scott has going on next and how to get his books, "Chupcabras and Other Mysteries" and "Flash Point : High Strangeness in Puerto Rico".

We ask Peter what direction does Ufology, as a science, need to go from here and he gives us his point-by-point take on what developments need to happen for the field to evolve. We find out what Peter's response is to those in Ufology who say we have to move on from "lights in the sky."

We wrap it up with an update on Peter's move to a former ICBM missile site this past Summer and how the listeners can help the National UFO Reporting Center.

BIOGRAPHY

Scott Corrales became interested in the UFO phenomenon as a result of the heavy UFO activity while he lived in both Mexico and Puerto Rico. He was also influenced by Mexican ufologists, Pedro Ferriz and Salvador Freixedo, a former Jesuit priest who advocated a paranormal, interdimensional interpretation of the phenomenon. In 1990, Scott began translating the works of Freixedo into English, making the literature and research of experts and journalists available to English-reading audiences everywhere. This led to the creation of the SAMIZDAT journal in 1993 and his collaboration with Mexico’s CEFP group, Puerto Rico’s PRRG, and the foremost researchers of Spain’s so-called “third generation” of UFO researchers.

In 1995, Corrales documented the manifestations of the entity popularly known as the “Chupacabras” in three works: “The Chupacabras Diaries”, “Nemesis: The Chupacabras at Large”, and “Chupacabras and Other Mysteries”. In 1998, the SAMIZDAT bulletin was replaced by the Inexplicata: The Journal of Hispanic Ufology, as the official publication of the nascent Institute of Hispanic Ufology. In addition, Scott has been a guest on numerous radio shows and his articles have been featured in several national publications.

His website is inexplicata.blogspot.com.

Scott Corrales.mp3

SEASON 2

10.14.06
203
Paul Kimball
(1 hr 43 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Some of the problems with Ufology today
• The "Condon Effect"
• How to generate interest in Ufology
• Why Paul doesn't see a "grand conspiracy" behind the UFO phenomenon
• Ufology on the Internet
• Why more young people aren't gravitating toward studying the UFO enigma

We pick up part 2 by continuing our discussion on Ufology, can serious minded research dissassociate itself from the overall umbrella of Ufology. Paul explains the lack of differentiation in Ufology between serious researchers and people with general interest in the field. We talk about the lack of an overarching scientific body in Ufology to provide peer review and govern over the field. He talks about the lack of uniformity and public relations in Ufology.

Paul talks about how there was serious media and science interest in UFOs decades ago, but seemingly this trend has dried up in recent years and why that has happened. He discusses what he calls "The Condon Effect" and how it had a terrible effect on Ufology. He also talks about how Ufology's attachment to Roswell and alien abductions throughout the last 20 years has hurt the field. He talks about how present day Ufology drives away mainstream scientists.

We discuss where the ultimate answer to the UFO riddle may come from. Paul advises Ufology on what it should be doing to generate interest and advance the field. From there, we move on to talk about why Paul doesn't believe in a grand conspiracy behind keeping the UFO phenomenon secret. He also discusses why the government may be sitting on some UFO information from the general population.

From there, we talk about Ufology on the Internet and we get Paul's take on it, including what sites he thinks are good resources for UFO research. He also talks about the problems of Ufology on the Internet and also some of the more promising developments, including podcasting and sites like youtube. Paul tells us about Jim Moseley, a well known figure amongst hardcore Ufology followers, but rather unknown to the more modern, general audience.

We wrap up the "big picture" discussion with an in-depth talk of Ufology's next generation, including why there doesn't seem to be much interest from the young generation in the UFO phenomenon. Paul talks about how the Ufological community repels younger newcomers as well as women with an interest in the UFO phenomenon. He compares Ufology to Big Band Music and tells us what he thinks is the "Rock and Roll" of esoterica today.

Paul previews "Fields of Fear", his documentary that is similar to "Stanton T. Friedman is Real", but profiling a cattle mutiliation researcher. He also gives an in-depth preview of his other upcoming film "Best Evidence : Top 10 UFO Cases".

BIOGRAPHY

After winning multiple scholarships and awards - including the University Medal in History at both Acadia University and the University of Dundee, and the CLB Award at Dalhousie Law School - Paul graduated from Acadia in 1989 with an Honours Degree in History and Political Science, and in 1992 from Dalhousie with an LL.B. After working for the Nova Scotia Film Development Corporation and Salter Street Films, and as a consultant on film and television to the governments of Prince Edward Island and Newfoundland, Paul founded Redstar Films Limited in 1999. His work as a producer and director since includes documentaries for networks including CBC, Vision, Bravo, SCN and Space: The Imagination Station, as well as the television series The Classical Now. Paul is a member of the Nova Scotia Barristers Society and the Society of Composers Authors and Publishers. He served as President of the Nova Scotia Film and Television Producers Association from 2002 to 2004, and is currently a member of the Film Advisory Committee for the Province of Nova Scotia.

His website is www.redstarfilms.blogspot.com/.

Paul Kimball, Part 2.mp3

SEASON 2

10.7.06
202
Paul Kimball
(1 hr 39 min.)

Topics discussed:

• How Paul got interested in the UFO phenomenon
• UFO documentaries
• Kimball's problems with exopolitics
• His no-holds-barred thoughts on Ufology in general
• Plus a preview of his New Frontiers Symposium, coming up on 10.14.6

We start out with Paul's background and how he got into following the world of Ufology. We talk about his first film within the genre, "Stanton T. Friedman is Real" and the serendipitous means by which Paul became director of the film and how it led to his career as a filmmaker. He talks about how being related to Stanton Friedman shaped his interest in the UFO mystery. He tells us what he thinks Friedman's greatest contribution to the field of Ufology is. This segues into a discussion on the film "Stanton T. Friedman is Real", how it's uniquely different from a lot of UFO related movies, acting as more biography than straight UFO film.

We move on to a more general discussion on UFO documentaries, including media coverage of said films and the paradox of making a film that can appeal to both laypeople and people with serious interest. He explains how he tailored his new film "UFOs : Best Evidence", with this paradox in mind. He also responds to his critics who claim that making a film like this would "accomplish nothing". From there, we discuss why most UFO documentaries today are "crap". We also discuss the problem of amateur made UFO films that hurt the overall genre of UFO documentaries.

We talk about how Paul's film, "Aztec 1948", came about including the making of the film and how's Paul's anti-Aztec opinion, post-filming, caused some controversy in the UFO field.

From there, we have an in-depth discussion on exopolitics, a movement which Kimball is harshly critical of. He explains where his opinion of the UFO phenomenon is fundamentally different from the exopolitics movement. He goes on to highlight his main criticisms of the expolitics movement. His brings his perspective, as a Canadian, to the Paul Hellyer story. He also explains why he thinks exopolitcs may be bad for Ufology as a whole and how the thinking of many in exopolitics with regards to "working with ETs" is flawed.

We find out what Paul thinks of Ufology taking on a more proactive approach and becoming more activist oriented. Following that, he explains how the "you're only as strong as your weakest link" argument applies to exopolitical whistleblowers. We talk about Roswell and how it can be looked upon as symptomatic of some of the problems of Ufology, what can be learned from Roswell with regards to UFO investigation, and why Roswell is destined to become a "myth" in human history, much like Robin Hood. This leads to Paul telling us what he thinks the biggest problem in UFO research is today. He differentiates between Ufology and what he sees as "serious UFO research".

We wrap up Part 1 with a preview of Paul's "New Frontiers Symposium", coming to Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada next weekend (10.14.2006). What speakers will be there, why did he choose them, how is this different from a "UFO conference", and much more.

BIOGRAPHY

After winning multiple scholarships and awards - including the University Medal in History at both Acadia University and the University of Dundee, and the CLB Award at Dalhousie Law School - Paul graduated from Acadia in 1989 with an Honours Degree in History and Political Science, and in 1992 from Dalhousie with an LL.B. After working for the Nova Scotia Film Development Corporation and Salter Street Films, and as a consultant on film and television to the governments of Prince Edward Island and Newfoundland, Paul founded Redstar Films Limited in 1999. His work as a producer and director since includes documentaries for networks including CBC, Vision, Bravo, SCN and Space: The Imagination Station, as well as the television series The Classical Now. Paul is a member of the Nova Scotia Barristers Society and the Society of Composers Authors and Publishers. He served as President of the Nova Scotia Film and Television Producers Association from 2002 to 2004, and is currently a member of the Film Advisory Committee for the Province of Nova Scotia.

His website is www.redstarfilms.blogspot.com/.

Paul Kimball, Part 1.mp3

SEASON 1

6.24.06
133
Gary McKinnon
(1 hr 8 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Notorious UK UFO hacker Gary McKinnon. McKinnon made worldwide news after he was charged with numerous counts of hacking into US government computers in search of UFO secrets
• We talk about the charges brought against him
• What UFO evidence he saw while hacking
• His take on the media coverage of his story
• and much much more

We begin the interview by going through the events that led to Gary's arrest, starting with his early interest in the UFO phenomenon and how that led to his decision to hack the US government's computers. We talk about the motivations behind his decision to pursue hacking as a means to get UFO secrets. Gary goes over the events of his arrest and how the UK officials' stance on his crimes changed after they'd been briefed by US officials. We find out the motivations of Gary's side in this legal fight and what they are looking for with regards to how the case may play out.

We find out at what point in the legal process did Gary's motivations of finding UFO secrets come to light and what the reaction of UK and US officials was to that revelation. What does Gary's family think of the charges against him and what does he fear most about the charges against him.

We talk about the other famous UK UFO Hacker, Matthew Bevan, and what made his case different from Gary's case. We talk about the addictive nature of hacking and what the reaction to his case has been from the hacking community. We also find out the extent of the computer limitations that have been placed on Gary by prosecutors. Did Gary have an end game in mind when he was hacking the computers and did he fear the eventuality of an arrest.

We reflect on why Gary doesn't have any "hard evidence" from his days searching for UFO secrets in the government computers. He talks about some of the circumstantial evidence he did see. We find out why Gary didn't print out any of the pictures he saw or save them for future use. He goes, in-depth, over the story of hacking NASA and looking for UFO pictures.

Is there a larger, known, community of hackers specifically looking for UFO secrets ? We cover the "non-terrestrial officers" aspect of his story from a number of different angles. We find out how long Gary was hacking NASA and what else he may have found. We cover the various organizations and events that Gary may have hacked into, ranging from DARPA, 911, the CIA, FBI, NSA, and HAARP.

Gary talks about the US government's plea bargain deal that he did not take and why he didn't take it. Did any aspect of the potential for employment come up with the prosecutors. Playing Devil's Advocate, we ask how Gary answers the critics who don't believe he was actually looking for UFO secrets.

What does Gary think of the attention that his story has drawn from the media, both mainstream and esoteric. Gary talks about how the UFO aspect of his story hurts his case in some ways and also how it has been pushed aside in the UK in favor of coverage of extradition laws. Why there was a 3 year period between the original charges being filed and Gary speaking out to the media and how his first interview with Jon Ronson came about. He also talks about the strange trend of the media portraying him as a "kid" and why he thinks that has come about. Gary dissuades the rumours of nefarious circumstances that kept him from appearing on Coast to Coast AM.

Is Gary particularly frustrated that he has no bargaining chip in the form of pictures or hard UFO evidence. We also find out about whatever additional evidence he may have had that was seized by the government. Gary talks about a few strange events that have happened since his story broke, including some stuff that's he's never told anyone before.

Has Gary heard from anyone within Ufology, either for support or criticism. Has Gary heard anything about the case from the UK Ministry of Defense UFO Department. What's the extent of the help that Gary is receiving from Steven Greer. How does Gary feel about being characterized as a "martyr for Ufology".

What's the timetable for Gary's case from here. How long does Gary think it will take for this case to be entirely settled. Does Gary discourage folks from hacking for UFO secrets and was his hacking for UFO secrets worth it. Is Gary sitting on any additional information that he's waiting to use that may be helpful for him in the future. We wrap it up with the story behind www.freegary.org.uk and how folks can help Gary out.

BIOGRAPHY

The former computer systems administrator is accused of hacking into 97 United States military and NASA computers in 2001 and 2002. The computer networks he is accused of hacking include networks owned by NASA, the US Army, US Navy, Department of Defense and the US Air Force, and also one belonging to The Pentagon. The US estimates claim the costs of tracking and correcting the problems he allegedly caused were around 700,000 USD.

McKinnon was originally tracked down and arrested under the Computer Misuse Act by the UK National Hi-Tech Crime Unit (NHTCU) in 2002, and later that year was also indicted by the United States government. He remained at liberty although subject to bail conditions including a requirement to sign in at his local police station every evening, and to remain at his home address at night. In addition he was banned from using a computer with access to the internet. There have been no further developments in respect of the charges relating to United Kingdom legislation, but in late 2005 the United States formally began extradition proceedings.

If he is extradited to the U.S. and charged, McKinnon faces up to 70 years in jail and has expressed fears that he could be sent to Guantanamo Bay. He has said that he will contest the extradition proceedings and believes that he should face trial in the UK, principally as he argues that his "crimes" were committed there and not in the United States.

You can find out more information on the latest developments in the Gary McKinnon case @ www.freegary.org.uk.

(Bio courtesy of wikipedia.)

Gary McKinnon.mp3

SEASON 1

5.27.06
130
Ryan Wood
(1 hr 37 min.)

Topics discussed:

• UFO crash cases
• UFO crash case study from a host of different angles
• We also touch on a number of other elements in Ufology
• SETI
• The Majestic documents
• SERPO
• The missing APRO documents
• Ryan previews the UFO Crash Retrieval Conference IV

We start out the interview by getting some background on Ryan Wood and how got into Ufology and why he decided to focus on documents and UFO crashes as opposed to other disciplines of Ufology. We also discuss the noteworthiness of Ryan being a second generation Ufologist and how he and his father are Ufology's only father and son tandem.

Moving on, we discuss the "kickoff" of the UFO Crash response from the government : the Battle of LA and how it necessitated the creation of the Interplanetary Phenomena Unit and what the IPU was. How the IPU led to MJ-12 and the chain of events that created MJ-12.

Talking about the vast number of cases chronicled in the book, Ryan discusses the various sources for the cases. We go on to talk about the "weighting system" that Ryan used in the book to determine an "authenticity scale" of the cases.

Ryan tells us about the pioneer of UFO crash retrieval research, Len Stringfield, and provides some enlightening information about the legendary Ufologist. Does Ryan think there is another case that could move up the ranks to become one of the legendary UFO crashes, ala Roswell, Kecksburg, Rendlesham, etc. and what are the elements necessary to investigate a UFO crash case. Ryan's reaction to the old standard, "give me your best case." What Wood thinks will take UFO Crash research to the "next level."

We also discuss the fact that there are also reports of a large number of ET casualties as a result of the crashes and where ET bodies seemed to factor into the level of interest from the government in relation to ET hardware. We touch on the tie-in between the Nogal Canyon Crash case and Ray Santilli and whether or not the recent Santilli news has a bearing on the veracity of the case.

Going over some numerical trends of the 74 cases reported, we talk about why there seems to be a drop-off in crash cases from the last 25 years or so. Is there something behind the seeming growth in international crash cases toward the latter half of the twentieth century. Why Ryan thinks that there may be many more crash cases scattered across the globe that remain hidden.

We talk about the portion at the end of the book that deals with SETI and why he included it in a book on UFO crashes. We move on from there to talk about Tim Cooper and his saga of receiving documents from a mysterious character named Thomas Cantwheel.

Tim busts out his two "pet questions" and asks Ryan about the SERPO story that is making the rounds in Ufology today and asks about the infamous missing APRO documents, the latter of which, Ryan provides some tantalizing information about and a sad story of lost data within MUFON back in the day.

Ryan discusses his fantastic website majesticdocuments.com and the vast amount of resources available there. We also talk about the UFO Crash Retrieval Conference, how it came about and how it has evolved. Ryan previews the Crash Retrieval Conference IV, including the many fine researchers who will be presenting there this year.

BIOGRAPHY

Born in Maryland in 1955, Ryan S. Wood first became interested in UFOs when his father, Dr. Robert Wood, was engaged in deciphering the physics of UFOs while managing a research project on anti-gravity for McDonnell Douglas. Ryan is now regarded as a leading authority on the Top Secret classified Majestic-12 intelligence documents and the 1941 Cape Girardeau, Missouri UFO Crash.

A frequent lecturer on the UFO subject, Ryan has taught college courses and made numerous presentations about UFOs to civic organizations and at ufology conferences. He has organized three worldwide UFO crash retrieval symposia (www.ufoconference.com) and once presented a UFO lecture to a class on National Security Affairs at the Naval Postgraduate School that formed the basis of the final exam. He manages the content of www.majesticdocuments.com and along with his father was the executive producer of a television documentary on the authenticity of the Majestic-12 documents called The Secret.

The website for the book "Majic Eyes Only" is www.majiceyesonly.com.

Ryan Wood.mp3

SEASON 1

5.6.06
128
Richard Dolan
(1 hr 38 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Early Ufology
• MK Ultra
• JFK & Ufology
• Serpo
• Charlie Sheen
• An in-depth preview of Richard's second book
• Plus tons more, of course

We begin this week's installment by continuing our discussion on J. Allen Hynek and what may have caused his change in perspective on the UFO phenomenon. We discuss the question posed in the book of how much the Air Force truly knew about the UFO phenomenon in the 1960's, was it cover-up or foul up.

Dolan dubs Donald Keyhoe "the most important UFO researcher ever" and explains why he came to that conclusion. We discuss Ewan Cameron, CIA mindbender, a truly bizarre character who shows up sporadically in Dolan's book and how Cameron's role in American history is germaine to the UFO phenomenon.

The effect the JFK assassination had on Ufology and the UFO phenomenon as a whole.

Tim asks Richard what he thinks of the Serpo story that is making the rounds of Ufology today and the overal idea of rumoured "deals" between the government and ETs.

We also have a lengthy discussion on the Charlie Sheen / 911 story that broke just prior to our interview and we get Dolan's opinion on the story and 911 in general. Does the Sheen story bode well for future revelations on the true nature of 911 ? This dovetails into a discussion on UFO disclosure and whether or not it will or can happen.

Richard previews the long awaited sequel to his book. What key areas are going to be covered, how he went about writing the follow-up, the problems associated with researching the book since it deals with recent events, and when the book will be released.

BIOGRAPHY

Richard M. Dolan was born in Brooklyn, New York, in 1962. He holds an MA in History from the University of Rochester and a BA in History from Alfred University. He earned a Certificate in Political Theory from Oxford University and was a Rhodes Scholar finalist. Prior to his interest in anomalous phenomena, Dolan studied US Cold War strategy, Soviet history, and international diplomacy.

In 2000, he published a 500-page study, UFOs and the National Security State. This is the first volume of a two-part historical narrative of the national security dimensions of the UFO phenomenon from 1941 to the present. Included are the records of more than fifty military bases relating to innumerable violations of sensitive airspace by unknown objects, demonstrating that the US military has taken the topic of UFOs seriously indeed.

Apollo 14 astronaut Dr. Edgar Mitchell has called Dolan’s book "monumental," while Dr. Hal Puthoff, Director of the Institute for Advanced Studies at Austin, has declared it to be "a must-read for serious students in the field."

Dolan has published numerous articles on anomalous phenomena, science, and the intelligence community for UFO Magazine. In 2003, he helped to found Phenomena, a magazine dedicated to leading edge issues pertaining to science and society, and for which he continues to serve as Senior Editor and regular contributor.

Dolan has been appeared many times on television documentaries and radio programs on the theme of UFOs and government disclosure. He has been a featured speaker at numerous conferences, including the International UFO Congress, the International MUFON Symposium, the Aztec UFO Symposium, and others.

Richard Dolan also continues to research and write volume two of UFOs and the National Security State. He lives with his family in Rochester, New York.

His website is www.keyholepublishing.com.

Richard Dolan, Part 2.mp3

SEASON 1

4.29.06
127
Richard Dolan
(1 hr 43 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Richard discusses his book "UFOs and the National Security State, Chronology of a Cover-Up 1947-1973" in-depth
• The making of the book
• Some of the key players and events in the history of the UFO cover-up

We kick off the interview by first finding out about Richard Dolan's background and how he ended up researching Ufology. The evolution of Richard's study of Ufology and the research going into the book. Richard's decision to highlight a number of sightings in the book and the editorial and stylistic decision behind that.

1947 as the beginnings of Ufology, yes and no. We talk about the delicate succession of Truman to Eisenhower and how the UFO secret seemed to be handled within the corridors of power. The crisis of 1960's caused by a major UFO wave and how the government handled it and how it led to today's atmosphere of non-disclosure from the government.

Richard discusses the story in the book of a 1951 meeting attended by Edward Ruppelt that included someone from a shadowy "controller group". Project Blue Book and its degeneration as an investigative unit and some of the reasons for this. He details an infamous potential UFO crash from 1962 and how it is covered by Blue Book.

We talk about the battle within the government in the 1950's between the "UFO Party" and those who wanted to keep the UFO secret "in-house" and how this theme seems to come up again and again throughout Ufology, including an in-depth discussion of the impact of the Freedom of Information Act on Ufology and the evolution of the FOIA and Ufology.

Richard tells us of a fascinating new development with regards to the FOIA that calls for re-classification of previously declassified documents. Frank Edwards and how he was the precursor to the esoteric radio genre.

Mysterious deaths and demises of early figures in Ufology, including the peculiar story of Edward Ruppelt's revised second book which was a complete reversal of his years of research into Ufology. This dovetails into a discussion on Roscoe Hillenkoeter and his sudden resignation from NICAP right before a Congressional hearing on UFOs. Richard reflects on what some of the reasons were for such a high level of secrecy regarding UFOs within the government when the UFO story first began to evolve and that hinders the changes of disclosure in contemporary times.

We discuss the infamous JNAP-146, one of the key directives coming from the Air Force that helped to shut down UFO reports from pilots, both military and commercial. The schizophrenic nature of the UFO enigma when it comes to the Air Force and society in general.

NICAP, its founding, its role in early Ufology, and its demise. APRO, NICAP's friendly rival, and their different approach to tackling the UFO phenomenon. MUFON, which began as NICAP and APRO were folding.

Richard talks about J. Allen Hynek and Ufology's romantization of him and how that portion of his book was perhaps the most controversial portion of the book.

BIOGRAPHY

Richard M. Dolan was born in Brooklyn, New York, in 1962. He holds an MA in History from the University of Rochester and a BA in History from Alfred University. He earned a Certificate in Political Theory from Oxford University and was a Rhodes Scholar finalist. Prior to his interest in anomalous phenomena, Dolan studied US Cold War strategy, Soviet history, and international diplomacy.

In 2000, he published a 500-page study, UFOs and the National Security State. This is the first volume of a two-part historical narrative of the national security dimensions of the UFO phenomenon from 1941 to the present. Included are the records of more than fifty military bases relating to innumerable violations of sensitive airspace by unknown objects, demonstrating that the US military has taken the topic of UFOs seriously indeed.

Apollo 14 astronaut Dr. Edgar Mitchell has called Dolan’s book "monumental," while Dr. Hal Puthoff, Director of the Institute for Advanced Studies at Austin, has declared it to be "a must-read for serious students in the field."

Dolan has published numerous articles on anomalous phenomena, science, and the intelligence community for UFO Magazine. In 2003, he helped to found Phenomena, a magazine dedicated to leading edge issues pertaining to science and society, and for which he continues to serve as Senior Editor and regular contributor.

Dolan has been appeared many times on television documentaries and radio programs on the theme of UFOs and government disclosure. He has been a featured speaker at numerous conferences, including the International UFO Congress, the International MUFON Symposium, the Aztec UFO Symposium, and others.

Richard Dolan also continues to research and write volume two of UFOs and the National Security State. He lives with his family in Rochester, New York.

His website is www.keyholepublishing.com.

Richard Dolan, Part 1.mp3

SEASON 1

4.15.06
125
Nick Redfern
(1 hr 31 min.)

Topics discussed:

• UK Ufology
• What it was like for Nick to be watched by the UK government
• Ufology in general
• His previous book, the controversial "Bodysnatchers in the Desert" and the estoeric fall-out
• Serpo
• Cryptozoology
• and much more

We kick off the interview with some background on Andre and how he decided to tackle the subjects of the Federal Reserve and National Security. We move on to discuss the origins of the NSA, along with Project Paperclip and whether or not the fascist mindset was imported from Germany post-WWII.

Fringe elements of Ufology that have drawn the attention of UK officials, including a bizarre story of animal mutilations at a zoo. binnall asks Nick Redfern about Bigfoot in the UK.

We move on to discuss what it was like for Nick, personally, to be monitored by the "powers that be". Nick gives a fascinating example of the type of stuff that happened to him while he was being "watched". Is it possible that the government's excuse of "subversive hunting" actually a disinformation campaign?

Can present day Ufologists find out if they have an FBI file ? Do they ? What about deceased Ufologists, how accessible are their FBI files ? Based on his research, what is going on with the UFO phenomenon and what does Nick Redfern think the government knows. Is there a core group within government that knows the true nature of the UFO phenemenon?

We discuss "Bodysnatchers in the Desert", Nick Redfern's book that came out last year and the furor that resulted in Ufology over its alternative view of Roswell. Nick shares any new information that has come out since the book came out. Towards the end of the interview, we discuss the Serpo story and Nick gives his opinion on it. We wrap it up with Nick's idea of where he sees Ufology going in the future and a tantalizing preview of some upcoming projects from him.

BIOGRAPHY

Nick Redfern is one of the world’s foremost authorities on UFOS. His previous books include A Covert Agenda; The FBI Files; Cosmic Crashes; Strange Secrets (with Andy Roberts); Three Men Seeking Monsters; and Body Snatchers in the Desert. He has written for Military Illustrated; Eye Spy; Fate; Fortean Times; Phenomena Magazine; and the London Daily Express newspaper. He runs the American office of the British-based Center for Fortean Zoology.

His website is www.nickredfern.com.

Nick Redfern, Part 2.mp3

SEASON 1

4.8.06
124
Nick Redfern
(1 hr 34 min.)

Topics discussed:

• We discuss Nick's book "On the Trail of the Saucer Spies"
• How he got interested in the UFO phenomenon
• His evolution as a researcher and writer
• The aspects of the surveillance being either covert or overt and what is behind each type
• What agencies are behind the surveillance and is there a chain of command ?
• The infamous contactees, how and why they drew the attention of the government
• Is the Air Force and/or FBI still conducting surveillance of Ufologists?
• How surveillance has changed over the years.
• Elements that can cause the government to monitor a Ufologist
• UFO research groups (NICAP, APRO, MUFON, etc.) and how extensive has the infiltration of them been over the years
• The infamous missing APRO files
• How extensive is the government paranoia of subversives in Ufology today?
• The stories of computer hackers Matthew Bevan and Gary McKinnon
• "Men in Black"
• The bizarre story of an ET possibly breaking into the office of a UK defense contractor and how it may actually be related to "psychic spies"
• "The Sandman"
• The huge burst of interest in Ufology in the UK in the 1990's
• UK Ufology versus US Ufology
• Early cases of UFO research conducted by the UK government dating as far back as 1913

The interview begins with getting some background on Nick Redfern and how he got interested in the UFO phenomenon, including his evolution as a researcher and writer. What made him decide to tackle the surveillance of Ufologists as the topic for his latest book. We discuss the aspects of the surveillance being either covert or overt and what is behind each type. What agencies are behind the surveillance and is there a chain of command ? The infamous contactees, how and why they drew the attention of the government. Is the Air Force and/or FBI still conducting surveillance of Ufologists ? How surveillance has changed over the years.

What are the elements that can cause the government to monitor a Ufologist. UFO research groups (NICAP, APRO, MUFON, etc.) and how extensive has the infiltration of them been over the years. Is it safe to assume that the Disclosure movement may fall under the gaze of government surveillance. What can happen once a UFO group is infiltrated by sinister forces. The infamous missing APRO files and how that situation arose.

Have the government's fears of subversives in Ufology ever been borne out ? How extensive is the government paranoia of subversives in Ufology today ? Nick tells the stories of computer hackers Matthew Bevan and Gary McKinnon.

Are "Men in Black" still an esoteric phenomenon or has it faded away ? The origins of the MIB stories and the two versions of MIBs. The strange MIB case that was actually revealed to be from the government via released declassified documents. The controversial story of UMMO and how the KGB may have been involved in it. The bizarre story of an ET possibly breaking into the office of a UK defense contractor and how it may actually be related to "psychic spies".

Nick also discusses "The Sandman", a major source for the book and the sort of information that he was provided from The Sandman. Nick gives a first hand perspective on the huge burst of interest in Ufology in the UK in the 1990's and how he and the other prominent UK researchers drew the attention of UK officials. He also explains why The Sandman was allowed to give him such candid information. How the popularity of Ufology in the UK has waned in the last few years and what the UK Ufology scene is like now.

UK Ufology versus US Ufology, the similarities and the differences. Nick also discusses some of the early cases of UFO research conducted by the UK government dating as far back as 1913. How the evolution of UK Ufology has mirrored American Ufology.

BIOGRAPHY

Nick Redfern is one of the world’s foremost authorities on UFOS. His previous books include A Covert Agenda; The FBI Files; Cosmic Crashes; Strange Secrets (with Andy Roberts); Three Men Seeking Monsters; and Body Snatchers in the Desert. He has written for Military Illustrated; Eye Spy; Fate; Fortean Times; Phenomena Magazine; and the London Daily Express newspaper. He runs the American office of the British-based Center for Fortean Zoology.

Nick Redfern, Part 1.mp3

SEASON 1

2.25.06
121
Loren Coleman
(1 hr 46 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Bigfoot from a plethora of different angles
• The "kill or no kill" debate with regards to Bigfoot
• The Chupacabra
• Loch Ness Monster
• Has it lost popularity in the last few years or is that an effect of media coverage ?
• Giant Squids
• Loren tackles questions sent in by BoA writers, Lesley and Khyron, dealing with the giant bears of Siberia and the story of the footage of giant squid that came out last year
• Would the capture of Bigfoot hurt cryptozoology in the long run ?
• How cryptozoology is becoming mainstream
• How the capture of Bigfoot may influence religion
• Loren's take on the paranormal aspects of Bigfoot and how his earlier work influenced his stance today
• Fraudulant work in the Bigfoot field (from both researchers and debunkers)
• His response to being a "go to" guy to settle these affairs
• Will Loren see the capture of the Bigfoot in his lifetime?
• The giant bears of Siberia
• Loren's other career as author in the field of human services
• His work on suicide clusters and copy cat crimes
• Discussion on his excellent book "The Copycat Effect"

In the first portion of the interview, we find out about Loren's background and how he came to become such a huge name in cryptozoology. We discuss the "kill or no kill" debate with regards to Bigfoot. Loren's concept of three "types" of Bigfoot that may be found in North America. Loren tackles questions sent in by BoA writers, Lesley and Khyron, dealing with the giant bears of Siberia and the story of the footage of giant squid that came out last year. We get Loren's take on the "million dollar bounty" on Bigfoot from last fall and where that story has gone since it first developed.

Would the capture of Bigfoot hurt cryptozoology in the long run ? How cryptozoology is becoming mainstream. How the capture of Bigfoot may influence religion. How long, after we capture one Bigfoot, would a second Bigfoot probably be captured. The initial Bigfoot capture, how it may play out differently depending on the way Bigfoot is captured. Loren's take on the paranormal aspects of Bigfoot and how his earlier work influenced his stance today. How Coleman feels about dealing with all the fraudulant work in the Bigfoot field (from both researchers and debunkers) and his response to being a "go to" guy to settle these affairs.

Loren explains how the Chupacabra became a media sensation in the 1990's, despite having been around for decades. Will Loren see the capture of the Bigfoot in his lifetime ? The Loch Ness Monster, has it lost popularity in the last few years or is that an effect of media coverage ? Loren's hugely popular blog Cryptomundo, how it came to be.

In the second portion of the interview, we discuss Loren's book "The Copycat Effect", We talk about The Sorrows of Young Werther, Suicide clusters including baseball and football suicide clusters and how Loren tried to warn Major League Baseball before a suicide cluster ended up happening. We talk about the nomenclature of suicide, which is a hotly debated topic among suicide experts.

We touch on school shootings and Loren makes a bold prediction for later this year. We hit on a host of media fads including shark attacks, mysterious kidnappings, teachers sleeping with students and other odd stories. The debate over the influence of entertainment on society is covered as well as the debate over prescription drugs and whether they influence school shootings.

We talk about how Loren balances being both a cryptozoologist and a nationally recognized expert on suicide clusters and whether his crypto work influences how he is perceived when dealing with the mainstream media and the topic of suicide clusters.

In total, this is a monstrous interview, covering both the world of cryptozoology and the world of media influence on society. A must-hear for any esoteric radio fan and easily a classic edition of BoA : Audio.

BIOGRAPHY

Loren Coleman is one of the world's leading cryptozoologists. An honorary member of the British Columbia Scientific Cryptozoology Club, and several other international organizations, he is also a Life Member of the International Society of Cryptozoology. Starting his fieldwork and investigations in 1960, after traveling and trekking extensively in pursue of cryptozoological mysteries, Coleman began writing to share his experiences in 1969.

Coleman has written seventeen books and more than three hundred articles, has appeared frequently on radio and television programs, and has lectured throughout North America, as well as in London and at Loch Ness. He has been both on- and off-camera consultant to NBC-TV's "Unsolved Mysteries," A & E's "Ancient Mysteries," History Channel's "In Search of History," Discovery Channel's "In the Unknown, " and other reality-based programs. He contributes cryptozoology columns, "On the Trail," to the London-based magazine Fortean Times, and "Mysterious World" to Fate, as well as regular articles to The Anomalist and Fortean Studies. In 2000, he served as the Senior Series Consultant to the new "In Search Of..." program which is scheduled for future broadcast on Fox and USA Network. During 2002, he was featured in the Sony Studios' "Search for the Mothman," available on the DVD of the movie The Mothman Prophecies.

Obtaining an undergraduate degree from Southern Illinois University-Carbondale, Coleman majored in anthropology, minored in zoology, and did some summer work in archaeology. He received a graduate degree in psychiatric social work from Simmons College in Boston. Coleman was admitted to the Ph.D. programs, and took doctoral coursework in social anthropology at Brandies University, and in sociology at the University of New Hampshire's Family Research Laboratory.

Coleman has been an instructor, assistant/associate professor, research associate, and documentary filmmaker, in various academic university settings, since 1980. He gave one of the first credit courses on the subject of cryptozoology in 1990, and examined cryptozoology films in his popular documentary course he taught through 2003 at the University of Southern Maine. He has written extensively in human services, having authored, coauthored, or edited eight books, including the critically acclaimed Suicide Clusters (Faber and Faber, 1987), appearing on "The Larry King Show" discussing it. His work on the suicides of baseball players was covered in Sports Illustrated, the Sporting News, ESPN, ESPN Classics and by all the major media and wire services.

His websites are www.cryptomundo.com and www.lorencoleman.com.

Loren Coleman.mp3

SEASON 1

2.18.06
120
Steve Bassett
(1 hr 48 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Steve reacts to the ABC UFO Special
• We look ahead to the 2008 campaign, Hilary Clinton, and what the '08 election would be like in a post-Disclosure world
• The need to avoid "witch hunts" against those who sustained UFO secrecy
• Which countries may have key developments in Disclosure in the future, including South America, Japan, Europe, Australia and a lengthy discussion on why it's "all or nothing" when it comes to China and disclosure.
• The various "roadblocks" to disclosure
• How Ufology needs to be more activist oriented
• Problems with those in esoterica who are resistant to or skeptical of Disclosure
• The "Pandora's Box" argument against Disclosure
• The argument that the government won't disclose because it can't control the nefarious aspects of the ETs
• 911 and how it affected the Disclosure process

In this concluding portion, Steve reacts to the ABC UFO Special and gives his thoughts on it's impact on the Disclosure Process. He takes a hard look at the year 2006 and how it the window for disclosure is open when it comes to US politics. We look ahead to the 2008 campaign, Hilary Clinton, and what the '08 election would be like in a post-Disclosure world. He also discusses various other elements of post-Disclosure world, like the need to avoid "witch hunts" against those who sustained UFO secrecy.

We take a veritable world wide tour to determine which countries may have key developments in Disclosure in the future, including South America, Japan, Europe, Australia and a lengthy discussion on why it's "all or nothing" when it comes to China and disclosure.

We wrap up the interview by covering the various "roadblocks" to disclosure, including why it Steve says "it's a process, not a movement", what needs to be done to make it a movement, and if he thinks Disclosure will happen before any formal movement comes about. We talk about how Ufology needs to be more activist oriented, problems with those in esoterica who are resistant to or skeptical of Disclosure, the "Pandora's Box" argument against Disclosure, the argument that the government won't disclose because it can't control the nefarious aspects of the ETs, and 911 and how it affected the Disclosure process.

This is an in-depth and lengthy interview that prepares the listener for a post-Disclosure world and gives insight as to how, where, and why it may happen. A truly fascinating discussion.

BIOGRAPHY

Steve Bassett is a political activist, founder of Paradigm Research Group, Executive Director of the Extraterrestrial Phenomena Political Action Committee (X-PPAC, pronounced expack), author of the Paradigm Clock website, and a political columnist, commentator and former Independent candidate for Congress. He is the executive producer of the X-Conference.

Presently he is the only registered lobbyist in the United States representing extraterrestrial related phenomena research/activist organizations, and X-PPAC is the first political action committee to target the political implications of extraterrestrial related phenomena. Between April 19 and November 5 of 2002 he conducted an independent candidacy in the 2002 congressional campaign in the 8th District of Maryland. It was the first instance in which a candidate on the November ballot in a federal election openly addressed the matter of an extraterrestrial presence and the government imposed truth embargo.

Since 1996 Bassett has assisted a number of organizations and initiatives, which have been making the case for 1) an end to the government embargo on the truth surrounding an extraterrestrial presence and 2) open congressional hearings to take the testimony of former military and agency employees witness to extraterrestrial related events and evidence. He has spoken to millions of Americans about the likelihood and implications of a formal disclosure event.

His website is www.paradigmclock.com.

Steve Bassett, Part 2.mp3

SEASON 1

2.11.06
119
Steve Bassett
(1 hr 44 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Steve's background
• How he got interested in the issue of UFO disclosure
• His activist organization the Paradigm Research Group and some of its goals
• Raising the level of self-awareness within Ufology
• His disdain for the term "UFO"
• The goals of the PRG
• His role as a lobbyist on the UFO issue
• Why the public is misinformed on lobbyists
• His campaign for Congress in 2002 on the UFO issue and what it was like running for Congress as an independent candidate
• The X-Conference
• The Paul Hellyer story
• The Brazilian Air Force disclosure story
• The trend of UFO stories coming out of the India Daily online newspaper

One of the key figures who inspired the evolution of Tim's work in esoterica, Steve Bassett sat down with BoA : Audio for a marathon conversation on 1.16.2006 to discuss his background, his work in UFO disclosure activism, and his thoughts on various exopolitical stories and possible future events.

In this first installment, we discuss how he got interested in the issue of UFO disclosure, his activist organization the Paradigm Research Group and some of its goals, including raising the level of self-awareness within Ufology, his disdain for the term "UFO", and the goals of the PRG.

Steve gives us some insight into his role as a lobbyist on the UFO issue, including why the public is misinformed on lobbyists. We also discuss his campaign for Congress in 2002 on the UFO issue and what it was like running for Congress as an independent candidate. The X-Conference, why he decided to start it, the business aspects of it, and his thoughts on it, as the creator and founder of the conference.

We finish up this week with an in-depth discussion on some of the big stories of 2005 in Exopolitics, like the Paul Hellyer story, the Brazilian Air Force disclosure story, and the trend of UFO stories coming out of the India Daily online newspaper.

BIOGRAPHY

Steve Bassett is a political activist, founder of Paradigm Research Group, Executive Director of the Extraterrestrial Phenomena Political Action Committee (X-PPAC, pronounced expack), author of the Paradigm Clock website, and a political columnist, commentator and former Independent candidate for Congress. He is the executive producer of the X-Conference.

Presently he is the only registered lobbyist in the United States representing extraterrestrial related phenomena research/activist organizations, and X-PPAC is the first political action committee to target the political implications of extraterrestrial related phenomena. Between April 19 and November 5 of 2002 he conducted an independent candidacy in the 2002 congressional campaign in the 8th District of Maryland. It was the first instance in which a candidate on the November ballot in a federal election openly addressed the matter of an extraterrestrial presence and the government imposed truth embargo.

Since 1996 Bassett has assisted a number of organizations and initiatives, which have been making the case for 1) an end to the government embargo on the truth surrounding an extraterrestrial presence and 2) open congressional hearings to take the testimony of former military and agency employees witness to extraterrestrial related events and evidence. He has spoken to millions of Americans about the likelihood and implications of a formal disclosure event.

His website is www.paradigmclock.com.

Steve Bassett, Part 1.mp3

SEASON 1

2.4.06
118
Colm Kelleher
(1 hr 4 min.)

Topics discussed:

• How and why Kelleher ended up working for NIDS
• The NIDS science board that oversaw the study at the Skinwalker Ranch and their reaction to the esoteric nature of the study
• Digging on the Skinwalker Ranch and the odd effects it produced
• What did the general science community think of the NIDS work and what did the esoteric community think of it
• The NIDS black triangle study
• Robert Bigelow's presence on the Skinwalker Ranch
• The "less is more" approach to studying the phenomena at Skinwalker Ranch
• His reaction to many in the esoteric community who want funding from NIDS
• Did the Gorman family read the book
• What's next for NIDS and Colm Kelleher
• and much much more

Recorded on 1.21.2006, binnall sat down with "Hunt for the Skinwalker" co-author Colm Kelleher to discuss NIDS, the Skinwalker Ranch and the book detailing the scientific work done by NIDS there.

Among the topics discussed include, how and why Kelleher ended up working for NIDS, the NIDS science board that oversaw the study at the Skinwalker Ranch and their reaction to the esoteric nature of the study, where the cattle came from after the Gorman family moved, digging on the Skinwalker Ranch and the odd effects it produced.

What did the general science community think of the NIDS work and what did the esoteric community think of it. The NIDS black triangle study and how that came about. How extensive was Robert Bigelow's presence on the Skinwalker Ranch. In light of all the shadowy rumours about NIDS Ranch and security concerns, why publish a book on it now.

The "less is more" approach to studying the phenomena at Skinwalker Ranch and Colm's thoughts on the best way to go about the research. His reaction to many in the esoteric community who want funding from NIDS. Did the Gorman family read the book, what's next for NIDS and Colm Kelleher and much much more.

This interview comes after Colm had done "the rounds" of esoteric talk shows, so there is a lot of ground as yet uncovered until this interview. A must hear for anyone interested in the book or the NIDS organization in general.

BIOGRAPHY

Colm Kelleher is a senior research scientist with a twenty-year career in cell and molecular biology. Following his PhD in biochemistry from the University of Dublin, Trinity College in 1983, Dr. Kelleher worked at Canada's flagship Ontario Cancer Institute, the Terry Fox Laboratory at the British Columbia Cancer Research Center in Vancouver and the National Jewish Center for Immunology and Respiratory Medicine in Denver. More recently, Dr. Kelleher served as Research Director for Bigelow Aerospace in Las Vegas and as administrator for one of its subsidiaries, Space Sciences, Inc.

Dr. Kelleher also acted as team leader and project manager for the National Institute for Discovery Science (NIDS). Currently, Dr. Kelleher is the Director of Labs for a biotechnology firm in San Francisco. He has authored 38 peer reviewed publications in molecular biology, immunology, biochemistry and virology as well as articles in popular magazines such as OMNI.

His websites are colmkelleher.com and huntfortheskinwalker.com.

Colm Kelleher.mp3

SEASON 1

10.1.05
104
Terry Hansen
(1 hr 10 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Hansen's background prior to writing his book
• What brought him to studying the UFO/media connection
• Complicity v. conspiracy with regards to the media's coverage of the UFO phenomenon
• Historical precendence that suggests a government/media cooperative
• Local media v. national media
• The role of propaganda and disinformation and the various methods used to employ them
• The Mexican UFO footage that was released last year
• The ABC UFO special
• Philip Klass
• Hansen's goals for the book
• The reaction of journalists to his book
• Whether or not history will record the contributions of today's Ufologists
• Forbidden science
• Basic cable UFO specials
• The pro-UFO media
• and a plethora of other fascinating material

A longtime goal of binnall's was completed on August 11th, 2005, when he interviewed Terry Hansen, author of "The Missing Times", for BoA : Audio, Season One. In this in-depth interview, we discuss Hansen's background prior to writing his book, what brought him to studying the UFO/media connection, complicity v. conspiracy with regards to the media's coverage of the UFO phenomenon, historical precendence that suggests a government/media cooperative, local media v. national media, the role of propaganda and disinformation and the various methods used to employ them.

We also cover the Mexican UFO footage that was released last year, the ABC UFO special, Philip Klass, Hansen's goals for the book, the reaction of journalists to his book, whether or not history will record the contributions of today's Ufologists, forbidden science in general, basic cable UFO specials, the pro-UFO media, and a plethora of other fascinating material.

BIOGRAPHY

Terry Hansen is a former technical magazine editor and now an independent journalist with a special interest in scientific controversies and the politics of mass media. He has followed the UFO controversy for much of his life and has occasionally written about it for various media, including National Public Radio and the Minneapolis Star & Tribune. He has been a guest on various regional and national broadcast programs, including Dreamland, the History Channel, Coast to Coast, and Strange Days. He has also spoken before various groups about UFO-related censorship and propaganda. In addition, he has organized and moderated two symposiums about "The Science and Politics of UFO Research" for the Science Museum of Minnesota in St. Paul, one of the nation's largest science museums.

Hansen holds a bachelor's degree in biology and a master's degree in science journalism, both from the University of Minnesota. He was a founding partner of KFH Publications, Inc., a Seattle computer-magazine publishing company. He is a licensed private pilot with ratings for single-engine aircraft and gliders, and skipper of the converted diesel-powered wooden fishing trawler, New Rosa. He lives in the Canadian Gulf Islands with his wife Jess.

(Bio via www.themissingtimes.com)

Terry Hansen.mp3

SEASON 1

12.17.06
114
Alfred Webre
(1 hour)

Topics discussed:

• How Webre came to be involved in the Paul Hellyer story
• How Hellyer's involvement in the UFO phenomenon started and how it has evolved
• The missing video of Hellyer's famous speech
• The political reaction in Canada to Hellyer's outspoken stance on UFO Disclosure
• The Exopolitical platform
• The "Four D's"
• Lesley poses a couple of rare questions for Webre on remote viewing
• How to deal with alien abductions during the Disclosure process
• What people can do to help forward the Disclosure movement

It's a truly one of a kind BoA : Audio, a co-production with Alfred Webre's Peace on Earth Radio, where binnall is reunited with Alfred Webre. Since their initial meeting, Webre has gone on to become an even greater force in the UFO Disclosure movement, most notably throughout the Paul Hellyer story that has become world wide news in the past month. Webre is at the forefront of advancing disclosure and binnallofamerica.com continues to chronicle his amazing journey. This is an ultrarare edition of BoA : Audio where binnall is both guest and host, sharing the stage with Webre.

In this conversation, we cover how Webre came to be involved in the Paul Hellyer story and how Hellyer's involvement in the UFO phenomenon started and how it has evolved. The odd story of the missing video of Hellyer's famous speech from this past September. The political reaction in Canada to Hellyer's outspoken stance on UFO Disclosure.

We also touch on the Exopolitical platform and the "Four D's", Disclosure, Decade of Contact, Disarmament, and Diplomacy. BoA's Lesley poses a couple of rare questions for Webre on remote viewing as evidence and how to deal with alien abductions during the Disclosure process. And,to finish up, what people can do to help forward the Disclosure movement in 2006. Recorded on December 11th, 2005.

BIOGRAPHY

Alfred Webre was a Fulbright Scholar and holds degrees from Yale University, Yale Law School (Yale Law School National Scholar), and the University of Texas Counseling Program. He has taught Economics at Yale University (Economics Department) and Civil Liberties at the University of Texas (Government Department), and has been a futurist at Stanford Research Institute. He has been General Counsel to the NYC Environmental Protection Administration, environmental consultant to the Ford Foundation, and Member, Governor's Emergency Taskforce on Earthquake Preparedness, State of California (1980-82). Webre produced and hosted the Instant of Cooperation, the first live radio broadcast between the USA and Soviet Union.

He is the author of the book "Exopolitics" and his website is www.exopolitics.com.

Alfred Webre.mp3

SEASON 1

11.19.05
111
Grant Cameron
(1 hr 31 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Republican v. Democrat and how that plays out in regards to the UFO secret
• Various presidents of the late 20th Century and what they may have known about UFOs
• "the briefing question"
• Grant's method for getting UFO information from government officials and key political candidates
• Dick Cheney, Wesley Clark, Hillary Clinton, Jimmy Carter
• The difficulty in getting Ufology to ask the briefing question of candidates
• The 2008 campaign and setting a strategy for getting answers to the UFO question
• Why getting a date of briefing is a key aspect of the question
• The media and how they are afraid to question the government about UFOs and how this fear extends to Ufology itself
• What will need to change in society that will make the UFO secret a mainstream issue
• The story of Laura Johnson's hunger strike to get answers to the UFO question and how it reflects poorly on Ufology
• If Grant is hopeful for Disclosure and what scenarios he thinks may lead to Disclosure.
• The story of Grant's run-in with Homeland Security
• Disclosure
• 19th century presidents
• What hinders the research at archives
• Grant's call for student papers on UFOs

Part 1 of this lengthy interview hit on a plethora of topics, including the "Charlie Red Star" UFO flap that was Grant's first exposure to the UFO phenomenon. An in-depth discussion of Wilbur Smith, head of the Canadian government's UFO study, covering a ton of ground including Smith's UFO report that went to the Canadian Prime Minister, his inventions that may have been developed with help from ETs, and the amazing story of "AFFA" and Mrs.Swan and Wilbur Smith's role in that affair. Grant also details Wilbur Smith's most famous role in Ufology, the Top Secret Memo document along with the story of the famous Wilbur Smith files and what became of them.

From there, we touch on Canadian Ufology v. American Ufology, the Canadian government's stance on UFOs, including discussion on Paul Hellyer, former Minister of Defense who recently came out in favor of Disclosure. Grant discusses the upcoming release of the Bill Clinton files and his game plan for getting UFO documents from the files. Following that, he reveals a stunning recent story regarding Bill Clinton alluding to a shadow government controlling the UFO secret and how the UFO community completely missed this story last month. What Grant thinks the government knows about the UFO secret.

Other topics discussed in Part 1 : At what point did the UFO secret get out of the hands of the President, which leads to discussion on the government's "covert disclosure", i.e. slow release of UFO information to the public via leaked documents and footage, including detailed discussion on the Holloman Air Force Base film. The direction this "covert disclosure" is going. The dual goals of "covert disclosure". Some discussion on Bill Moore and how his story applies to the concept of "covert disclosure". How this is going on today. The key to researching documents that circulate in Ufology today.

BIOGRAPHY

We start out with the question of Republican v. Democrat and how that plays out in regards to the UFO secret. This leads to discussion of the various presidents of the late 20th Century and what they may have known about UFOs. From here, we have a lengthy discussion on "the briefing question", Grant's method for getting UFO information from government officials and key political candidates. Dick Cheney and Wesley Clark and how they reacted to the briefing question. The difficulty in getting Ufology to ask the briefing question of candidates.

Moving on to the 2008 campaign and setting a strategy for getting answers to the UFO question. Hilary Clinton and how to question her on the UFO subject. Jimmy Carter and his encounter with "the briefing question", including two times Grant tried to ask him and the effort was thwarted. Also, why getting a date of briefing is a key aspect of the question.

We discuss the media and how they are afraid to question the government about UFOs and how this fear extends to Ufology itself. What will need to change in society that will make the UFO secret a mainstream issue. The story of Laura Johnson's hunger strike to get answers to the UFO question and how it reflects poorly on Ufology.

The second half of this week's portion asks if Grant is hopeful for Disclosure and what scenarios he thinks may lead to Disclosure. We also hear the story of Grant's run-in with Homeland Security at the border. What he thinks of it two months later and how it has effectively shut down his trips to America for now. The bright side of the incident and how Ufology reacted to Grant's border adventure.

There's also more on Disclosure and how it may play out and the problems that are keeping it from coming out. binnall asks about 1800's presidents and if Grant has examined any potential UFO incidents from that time. What hinders the research at archives. Grant's call for student papers on UFOs. Details on some awesome and thorough CD ROMs available from Grant's website that deal in all the aspects of his research and future research coming from Grant Cameron.

This is a lengthy interview that covers a ton of ground and Cameron is brutally honest in his thoughts on Ufology and Disclosure. A must hear for anyone who considers themselves a serious student of Ufology.

Grant Cameron, Part 2.mp3

SEASON 1

11.12.05
110
Grant Cameron
(1 hr 31 min.)

Topics discussed:

• The "Charlie Red Star" UFO flap
• Wilbur Smith, head of the Canadian government's UFO study
• Smith's inventions that may have been developed with help from ETs
• The amazing story of "AFFA" and Mrs.Swan
• Canadian Ufology v. American Ufology
• The Canadian government's stance on UFOs
• Paul Hellyer
• The upcoming release of the Bill Clinton files and his game plan for getting UFO documents from the files
• He reveals a stunning recent story regarding Bill Clinton alluding to a shadow government controlling the UFO secret
• What Grant thinks the government knows about the UFO secret
• The government's "covert disclosure"
• Leaked documents and footage
• The Holloman Air Force Base film
• Bill Moore
• The key to researching documents that circulate in Ufology today

Part 1 of this lengthy interview hit on a plethora of topics, including the "Charlie Red Star" UFO flap that was Grant's first exposure to the UFO phenomenon. An in-depth discussion of Wilbur Smith, head of the Canadian government's UFO study, covering a ton of ground including Smith's UFO report that went to the Canadian Prime Minister, his inventions that may have been developed with help from ETs, and the amazing story of "AFFA" and Mrs.Swan and Wilbur Smith's role in that affair. Grant also details Wilbur Smith's most famous role in Ufology, the Top Secret Memo document along with the story of the famous Wilbur Smith files and what became of them.

From there, we touch on Canadian Ufology v. American Ufology, the Canadian government's stance on UFOs, including discussion on Paul Hellyer, former Minister of Defense who recently came out in favor of Disclosure. Grant discusses the upcoming release of the Bill Clinton files and his game plan for getting UFO documents from the files. Following that, he reveals a stunning recent story regarding Bill Clinton alluding to a shadow government controlling the UFO secret and how the UFO community completely missed this story last month. What Grant thinks the government knows about the UFO secret.

Other topics discussed in Part 1 : At what point did the UFO secret get out of the hands of the President, which leads to discussion on the government's "covert disclosure", i.e. slow release of UFO information to the public via leaked documents and footage, including detailed discussion on the Holloman Air Force Base film. The direction this "covert disclosure" is going. The dual goals of "covert disclosure". Some discussion on Bill Moore and how his story applies to the concept of "covert disclosure". How this is going on today. The key to researching documents that circulate in Ufology today.

BIOGRAPHY

Grant Cameron is a native Canadian who has been studying the UFO phenomenon for 30 years. He started in 1975 as one of the principal investigators of the "Charlie Red Star" UFO flap of the mid-70's. From there, his investigation led to the story of Wilbur Smith, head of the Canadian government UFO investigation Project Magnet, culminating with an in-depth investigation of US Presidents and both their relationship with the UFO secret. He is a highly esteemed researcher in Ufology who has lectured throughout North America on the 1975 UFO flap that got him involved in Ufology, Canada's early attempts to study UFOs, Disclosure politics, and the Presidential UFO connection.

His website is www.presidentialufo.com.

Grant Cameron, Part 1.mp3

SEASON 1

11.5.05
109
Peter Robbins
(1 hr 45 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Larry Warren's reaction to everyday skeptics
• Peter and Larry's UFO encounter on their first trip to Rendelsham to research for the book
• The alternate book "Confidential" that Peter produced to protect himself
• Peter's interraction with Colonel Holt
• Peter's stance on witnesses coming forward after having a UFO experience in the military
• Did Peter receive any harassment from the government?
• The NSA's role in the story
• The nuclear weapons element to the Rendlesham story
• Reflections on the reactions to the book
• Problems with the book's original publisher and whether the book may have been "buried"
• Peter's relationship with Larry since publishing the book
• A lighthearted discussion on women in Ufology
• A lengthy discussion on Japanese Ufology
• Japanese Ufology v. American Ufology
• Chinese Ufology
• The evolution of Ufology on the Internet
• Peter's development of UFOcity.com

This week's installment of BoA : Audio, is Part 2 of a lengthy interview conducted with Peter Robbins, co-author of "Left at East Gate", on September 5th, 2005. A plethora of ground is covered in this mammoth broadcast and it is a must-hear for any researcher interested in the Rendelsham Forest story and Ufology as a whole.

In this week's installment, we cover Larry Warren's reaction to everyday skeptics, the details of Peter and Larry's UFO encounter on their first trip to Rendelsham to research for the book and Peter's thoughts on including the encounter in the book. From there, we cover their struggles to finish writing the book, the alternate book "Confidential" that Peter produced to protect himself, and what got the writing of the book back on track. We also discuss Peter's interraction with Colonel Holt, one of the key players in the Bentwaters case and Peter's stance on witnesses coming forward after having a UFO experience in the military.

Also, did Peter receive any harassment from the government while writing the book, including a bizarre story from one of his trips to England. The NSA's role in the story and Peter's reaction to researching them. The nuclear weapons element to the Rendlesham story and how it ended up getting into the public domain. Reflections on the reactions to the book and the past 8 years since publication of "Left at East Gate". Problems with the book's original publisher and whether the book may have been "buried". Details on the new edition of "Left at East Gate", coming in December, and plans for the 25 anniversary of the Rendelsham Forest incident. And, finally, Peter's relationship with Larry since publishing the book.

Following all that we have a lighthearted discussion on women in Ufology, a lengthy discussion on Japanese Ufology and Peter's trip to Japan to present at a conference there, Japanese Ufology v. American Ufology, Chinese Ufology and the evolution of Ufology on the Internet and Peter's development of UFOcity.com.

BIOGRAPHY

Peter Robbins has been involved in UFO studies for more than twenty-five years, as a researcher, investigator, writer, lecturer, activist and author. He is a board member of Budd Hopkins' Intruders Foundation (which researches the alien abduction phenomenon), and is co-author of the British best-seller, Left at East Gate: A First-Hand Account of the Bentwaters-Woodbridge UFO Incident, Its Cover-Up and Investigation*. Peter is a current contributor to Phenomena Magazine, UFO Magazine, UFO Report Japan, FATE magazine, www.phemonenamagazine.com, www.UFOdata.uk, among other publications and websites.

Robbins has lectured extensively both in the States and abroad, including dozens of talks throughout the United Kingdom. Venues have included local, national and international conferences as well as presentations for organizations, seminars, private groups, public, private and secondary schools, universities, libraries, scientific organizations, educational foundations and Cambridge Hospital in Boston under the sponsorship of the late Pulitzer Prize winner Dr. John Mack. Robbins’ lecture topics have included but not been limited to the United Kingdom’s RAF Bentwaters-Woodbridge UFO incident; the suppression of UFO information by the American and British Governments; James Vincent Forrestal, first Secretary of Defense and early casualty of UFO secrecy; the emergence of the national security state; Dr. Wilhelm Reich and UFOs; the UFO abduction phenomenon; the crop circle phenomenon, and the media and UFOs.

Peter also served as Art Director and investigator for the New York City-based Scientific Bureau of Investigation (SBI), a national police and civilian UFO research organization and as Editorial Assistant on [requested] "Blue Memorandum" for Parliament's House of Lords Debate on UFOs, January 1980; Research Assistant on United Nations Secretary General's Report "for the establishment of a UN-UFO Department." Peter is a native New Yorker and can be reached by email via probbinsny@yahoo.com.

* An updated and expanded edition of Left At East Gate is scheduled for republication by Cosimo Press, New York, this December. StatCounter - Free Web Tracker and Counter

Peter Robbins, Part 2.mp3

SEASON 1

10.29.05
108
Peter Robbins
(1 hr 32 min.)

Topics discussed:

• An in-depth discussion on the book he co-authored, "Left at East Gate"
• The UFO incident at Rendlesham/Bentwaters
• The story of Larry Warren and his role both in the incident and following it, trying to bring it to the attention of the mass public
• Peter's background prior to getting involved in the Rendelsham case
• A comprehensive clinic on the 3 days in December known now as the "Rendelsham Forest Incident"
• Larry Warren's reaction to being a witness as the Bentwaters story broke
• His conduit to Ufology
• Larry Fawcett
• The early TV segments devoted to Bentwaters and how it was a historic story for CNN
• Peter's role in meeting Larry Warren and the subsequent decision to co-write "Left At East Gate"
• and much, much more

After becoming friends @ X-Conference I in Washington, D.C, 2004, Peter Robbins and I sat down for a marathon conversation on September 5th, 2005 for an in-depth discussion on the book he co-authored, "Left at East Gate", and its topic : the UFO incident at Rendlesham/Bentwaters, particularly, the story of Larry Warren and his role both in the incident and following it, trying to bring it to the attention of the mass public.

In this week's installment, we discuss Peter's background prior to getting involved in the Rendelsham case, an comprehensive clinic on the 3 days in December known now as the "Rendelsham Forest Incident" as Peter takes us through the entire story with remarkable detail. We also discuss Larry Warren's reaction to being a witness as the Bentwaters story broke, his conduit to Ufology, Larry Fawcett, the early TV segments devoted to Bentwaters and how it was a historic story for CNN, Peter's role in meeting Larry Warren and the subsequent decision to co-write "Left At East Gate" and much, much more.

Along the way, Peter previews the new updated edition of "Left at East Gate", coming soon, and also a new Rendlesham documentary that will be on the History Channel in December.

BIOGRAPHY

Peter Robbins has been involved in UFO studies for more than twenty-five years, as a researcher, investigator, writer, lecturer, activist and author. He is a board member of Budd Hopkins' Intruders Foundation (which researches the alien abduction phenomenon), and is co-author of the British best-seller, Left at East Gate: A First-Hand Account of the Bentwaters-Woodbridge UFO Incident, Its Cover-Up and Investigation*. Peter is a current contributor to Phenomena Magazine, UFO Magazine, UFO Report Japan, FATE magazine, www.phemonenamagazine.com, www.UFOdata.uk, among other publications and websites.

Robbins has lectured extensively both in the States and abroad, including dozens of talks throughout the United Kingdom. Venues have included local, national and international conferences as well as presentations for organizations, seminars, private groups, public, private and secondary schools, universities, libraries, scientific organizations, educational foundations and Cambridge Hospital in Boston under the sponsorship of the late Pulitzer Prize winner Dr. John Mack. Robbins’ lecture topics have included but not been limited to the United Kingdom’s RAF Bentwaters-Woodbridge UFO incident; the suppression of UFO information by the American and British Governments; James Vincent Forrestal, first Secretary of Defense and early casualty of UFO secrecy; the emergence of the national security state; Dr. Wilhelm Reich and UFOs; the UFO abduction phenomenon; the crop circle phenomenon, and the media and UFOs.

Peter also served as Art Director and investigator for the New York City-based Scientific Bureau of Investigation (SBI), a national police and civilian UFO research organization and as Editorial Assistant on [requested] "Blue Memorandum" for Parliament's House of Lords Debate on UFOs, January 1980; Research Assistant on United Nations Secretary General's Report "for the establishment of a UN-UFO Department." Peter is a native New Yorker and can be reached by email via probbinsny@yahoo.com.

* An updated and expanded edition of Left At East Gate is scheduled for republication by Cosimo Press, New York, this December. StatCounter - Free Web Tracker and Counter

Peter Robbins, Part 1.mp3

SEASON 1

10.8.05
105
Robert Miles
(1 hr 15 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Robert discusses the ET encounter he had in the early 1970's
• His book, "Safe Space"
• Why he chose to write fiction as opposed to non-fiction
• His post-contact experience
• The reaction of his friends
• If he's heard from the ETs since
• His upcoming documentary film "The Fastwalker Files"
• What may be in store for future Fasterwalker Files films
• Disclosure
• Abductions v. ET contact expereriences
• Different ET races
• The messages emparted to him from the ETs regarding humankind's future
• and a host of other esoteric topics

After briefly appearing at the end of BoA : Audio, the X-Conference Sessions, Robert Miles rejoins us for a full legth discussion. In an interview conducted on July 29th, 2005, binnall and Miles discuss the ET encounter he had in the early 1970's that changed his life and prompted him to write his book, "Safe Space". During this conversation, Miles explains why he chose to write fiction as opposed to non-fiction, his post-contact experience, including the reaction of his friends and if he's heard from the ETs since.

We also discuss his upcoming documentary film "The Fastwalker Files", which showcases a wide array of international Ufologists, along with what may be in store for future Fasterwalker Files films. We cover disclosure, is it emminent, abductions v. ET contact expereriences, different ET races, the messages emparted to him from the ETs regarding humankind's future, and a host of other esoteric topics.

BIOGRAPHY

Robert Miles is a television and motion picture writer and producer with thirty years experience. He has written and published numerous articles, and non-fiction stories. An avid adventurer, Robert designed and built four sailing vessels, cruised to Hawaii, Baja Mexico, and Honduras. His book "Safespace" is a manifestation of his personal extraterrestrial experience.

His website is www.safespaceproject.com.

Robert Miles.mp3

SEASON 1

10.1.05
104
Terry Hansen
(1 hr 10 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Hansen's background prior to writing his book
• What brought him to studying the UFO/media connection
• Complicity v. conspiracy with regards to the media's coverage of the UFO phenomenon
• Historical precendence that suggests a government/media cooperative
• Local media v. national media
• The role of propaganda and disinformation and the various methods used to employ them
• The Mexican UFO footage that was released last year
• The ABC UFO special
• Philip Klass
• Hansen's goals for the book
• The reaction of journalists to his book
• Whether or not history will record the contributions of today's Ufologists
• Forbidden science
• Basic cable UFO specials
• The pro-UFO media
• and a plethora of other fascinating material

A longtime goal of binnall's was completed on August 11th, 2005, when he interviewed Terry Hansen, author of "The Missing Times", for BoA : Audio, Season One. In this in-depth interview, we discuss Hansen's background prior to writing his book, what brought him to studying the UFO/media connection, complicity v. conspiracy with regards to the media's coverage of the UFO phenomenon, historical precendence that suggests a government/media cooperative, local media v. national media, the role of propaganda and disinformation and the various methods used to employ them.

We also cover the Mexican UFO footage that was released last year, the ABC UFO special, Philip Klass, Hansen's goals for the book, the reaction of journalists to his book, whether or not history will record the contributions of today's Ufologists, forbidden science in general, basic cable UFO specials, the pro-UFO media, and a plethora of other fascinating material.

BIOGRAPHY

Terry Hansen is a former technical magazine editor and now an independent journalist with a special interest in scientific controversies and the politics of mass media. He has followed the UFO controversy for much of his life and has occasionally written about it for various media, including National Public Radio and the Minneapolis Star & Tribune. He has been a guest on various regional and national broadcast programs, including Dreamland, the History Channel, Coast to Coast, and Strange Days. He has also spoken before various groups about UFO-related censorship and propaganda. In addition, he has organized and moderated two symposiums about "The Science and Politics of UFO Research" for the Science Museum of Minnesota in St. Paul, one of the nation's largest science museums.

Hansen holds a bachelor's degree in biology and a master's degree in science journalism, both from the University of Minnesota. He was a founding partner of KFH Publications, Inc., a Seattle computer-magazine publishing company. He is a licensed private pilot with ratings for single-engine aircraft and gliders, and skipper of the converted diesel-powered wooden fishing trawler, New Rosa. He lives in the Canadian Gulf Islands with his wife Jess.

(Bio via www.themissingtimes.com)

Terry Hansen.mp3

SEASON 1

9.24.05
103
Marshall Klarfeld
(1 hr 23 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Marshall discusses his book "Adam, The Missing Link"
• The ET progenitor theory
• How Marshall first got into researching this theory
• His thoughts on the various forms of evidence for an ET presence in early humankind
• The concept of ancient monuments as beacons for ET craft
• The creationism v. evolution debate and how this theory can bridge the gap between the two camps
• The role of religion in the ancient ET theory
• How Jesus may fit into the puzzle
• The Epic of Gilgamesh
• The work of Zecharia Sitchen
• Marshall's reaction to the various critics of Sitchen
• Disclosure and how it applies to the ET progenitor theory
• NASA's announcement of the discovery of yet another 10th planet
• and much much more

On August 5th, 2005, binnall sat down with Marshall Klarfeld to discuss his book "Adam, The Missing Link" and the ET progenitor theory. Included in this discussion was how Marshall first got into researching this theory, his thoughts on the various forms of evidence for an ET presence in early humankind, the concept of ancient monuments as beacons for ET craft, the creationism v. evolution debate and how this theory can bridge the gap between the two camps, the role of religion in the ancient ET theory, including how Jesus may fit into the puzzle.

In addition to all that, we discuss the Epic of Gilgamesh, the work of Zecharia Sitchen, including Marshall's continued correspondence with him and Marshall's reaction to the various critics of Sitchen, Disclosure and how it applies to the ET progenitor theory, NASA's announcement of the discovery of yet another 10th planet, and much much more.

BIOGRAPHY

As an undergraduate student at CALTECH in the late 1940’s, Marshall was fascinated by the advanced scientific knowledge found in the Bible’s story of creation. Genesis describes the creation of our solar system as occurring in a 6 “day” time frame.

His question was, how did this 5,000 year old Bible description of the birth of our solar system disclose the advanced scientific information (the ignition of our Sun occurs at the 4th “day”, in a 6 “day” creation process), thousands of years before we discovered it?

Uncertain how to unravel this puzzle, he questioned his Nobel laureate professors, Linus Pauling and Richard Feynman. Their powerful answers stayed with him for decades and inspired him to pursue the knowledge that he is now able to share with the readers of "Adam, The Missing Link."

Marshall Klarfeld.mp3

SEASON 1

9.17.05
102
Jim Marrs
(1 hr 9 min.)

Topics discussed:

• Remote Viewing
• It's drop in popularity and credibility
• The strangest thing is that Jim has heard of being Remote Viewed
• 911
• We first outline the case behind 911 being a "inside job"
• We briefly touch upon the phenomenon of solid information getting out in the early hours of an event and subsquently covered up
• Possible nuke attacks in America
• What circumstances would indicate that an attack is emminent
• What the result would be for America
• The 2004 presidential election and voting machines
• Border security
• 2012
• The Bible Code
• Jim's appearance on the Penn and Teller show
• What an average day is like for Jim Marrs
• and much much more

Part 2 of the Jim Marrs interview was recorded on 8.4.2005. In this hour long discussion, we cover Remote Viewing, it's drop in popularity and credibility and why that has happened. We also talk about what the strangest thing is that Jim has heard of being Remote Viewed. Moving on to 911, we first outline the case behind 911 being a "inside job". Within that discussion, we briefly touch upon the phenomenon of solid information getting out in the early hours of an event and subsquently covered up. Following that, we cover possible nuke attacks in America. What circumstances would indicate that an attack is emminent and what the result would be for America, both near term and long term.

Also included in this interview : the 2004 presidential election and voting machines, border security, 2012, the Bible Code, Jim's appearance on the Penn and Teller show, what an average day is like for Jim Marrs, and much much more.

BIOGRAPHY

Jim Marrs is the author of the esoteric classics "Crossfire", "Rule By Secrecy", and "Alien Agenda". They are essential reading for all esoteric researchers. Jim Marrs has also authored one of the first books ever on Remote Viewing, "Psi Spies", and two books on 911, "War on Freedom" and "Inside Job". His website is www.jimmarrs.com.

Jim Marrs, Part 2.mp3

SEASON 1

9.10.05
101
Jim Marrs
(1 hr 3 min.)

Topics discussed:

• The JFK assassination
• The overall agenda behind it
• Various other theories re: the assassination and what purpose they ultimately serve
• Jim's role in making the Oliver Stone JFK movie
• The JFK - UFO connection
• The evolution of Ufology
• What is the "alien agenda" and what it probably isn't
• Disclosure
• NASA
• A possible covert space program
• Secret Societies
• The pyramid power structure and how it works
• How many people are at the top of the pyramid and who they might be
• Examples of the pyramid in action with the media
• and much much more

BoA : Audio, Season One kicks off with Jim Marrs in an interview conducted on July 28th, 2005. In the first installment, we discuss the JFK assassination, the overall agenda behind it, various other theories re: the assassination and what purpose they ultimately serve, Jim's role in making the Oliver Stone JFK movie, the JFK - UFO connection, the evolution of Ufology, what is the "alien agenda" and what it probably isn't, Disclosure, NASA, a possible covert space program, Secret Societies, the pyramid power structure and how it works, how many people are at the top of the pyramid and who they might be, examples of the pyramid in action with the media and much much more.

BIOGRAPHY

Jim Marrs is the author of the esoteric classics "Crossfire", "Rule By Secrecy", and "Alien Agenda". They are essential reading for all esoteric researchers. Jim Marrs has also authored one of the first books ever on Remote Viewing, "Psi Spies", and two books on 911, "War on Freedom" and "Inside Job". His website is www.jimmarrs.com.

Jim Marrs, Part 1.mp3